Should Kids Toons Be Allowed use Nazis When Appropriate?

You do realise this is outside of their control, right? So don't blame them. As for the DCAU example, pretty sure they weren't run by Vandal savage, nor did they use high tech weapons.

Also, if you bothered to watch the short(Which it seems you didn't), you would notice that Red Skull was wearing a SS uniform.
 
Oh yeah, I remember that episode. I always thought that part of his fantasy flashback was odd. I think that episode aired around five or six years ago. Maybe the fact that it was played as a joke, as opposed to being serious like with Captain America's backstory, allowed that scene to make it to the final product. I'm not sure if there's a better chance of seeing a kids' cartoon having some kind of comical/non serious moment involving Nazis though.

As for the original question, I definitely think that it should be allowed within reason. It obviously wouldn't work to show all of the graphic aspect of the history, but showing them fighting in WWII would be enough. After all, most kids already know about Nazis by the time they're in fifth or sixth grade. I'm pretty sure I learned about WWII by ten at the very latest, even though I think it was really eight. It's kind of weird that they apparently eliminated/replaced Nazis with Captain America's backstory. I understand that it was out of their control and all, but it's still a bit weird that they couldn't show some kind of sign or make it clear that they were still Nazis without referring them as such, like with Savage Time, but I guess they didn't have much of a choice.
 
What I mean is, they were still protayed as what they were. They didn't try to Hogan'sHeroesize them and make them comical. The were evil. Don't make a Nazi into a comical character, don't make them aliens, and don't delete them from history. They were there. They existed. Oh, so you're scare you may hurt the feelings a few Germans? Well, they have every right to be ashamed an have their feelings hurt! Imagine if the Civil War were shown in a cartoon but the Confederates were replaced by HYDRA, because it may offend people in the South because they had blacks as slaves once and they fought for it. It's history. There are some things you don't change, even in a cartoon.
 
Come on, even TMNT 2K3 mentioned Nazis.

I can understand the reasoning behind changing it but I certainly don't agree withi it. They could just edit out any images of the swastika when it hit the German market, or even just heavily imply that the forces were Nazis without outright mentioning it. But this approach is frankly cowardly.
 
It's not just Germany, it's multiple other countries that don't allow references to Nazis unless it's for historical or artistic puposes, it's not about "hurting their feelings". These shows are made to be air world wide in case you forgot. They're not ignoring it since they still have it in their history books and films.

As for the aliens thing, you know that's not the first time the media have given Nazis "Sci-Fi" or an occult handle in shows, right?

And having heroes in these stories already makes it clear it isn't an accurate showing of history, so it's all moot anyway.

And again, you guys did notice that Red Skull is wearing an SS uniform, right? Seriously, did you actually watch the episode?

Also, your confederate analogy doesn't work, since HYDRA always had ties to nazis in the comics anyway and they are not replacing them. If anything, it's proably the same situation as in the movie. Besides, one of the earlier episdoes mentioned HYDRA was around for 60 years.
 
I remember there was an X-men: Evolution episode where Captain America guest-starred. Wolverine mentioned they had fought in World War 2, and there was a flashback to some of the fighting. Captain America and Wolverine even break a bunch of captives out of a prison camp. Now it's been a while, but I don't remember any direct mention of the word "Nazi" or any Nazi insignias, but I don't think there was any confusion or cover-up regarding who they were fighting against. (Just looked up the original airdate - I was 14 when that episode first played, haha!)

Anyway, the thing was, you got the point without overt references, and I'm sure any child who knew anything about World War 2 got the point, too. I think that's all you really need.
 
Here's the thing, just because the excutives that show had to deal with gave them more wiggle room, doesn't mean the TV excutives this show has to deal with are as understanding.

Infact, the orginally wanted to do something similar to the example you made(along with the HYDRA agents), but they had to remove them.
 
Actually, German laws don't allow the use of explicit Nazi imagery such as swastikas unless it's for historical or artistic purposes. That doesn't mean a blanket ban on any reference to WWII, as I've pointed out both on this thread and the Avengers one, lots of kids shows have managed to depict WWII German soldiers without explicitly referring to them as Nazis or using swastikas.



There's a big difference between simply using creative license to embellish real world history with fantastic elements, and outright whitewashing the whole of World War II.



Yes I did indeed notice and while I appreciate them throwing us that bone at least, it does raise the question. If it's okay to have the Skull running about in a slightly modified SS uniform, why couldn't they spot his henchmen similar attire instead of funky green jumpsuits?
 
I wasn't commenting on the new show specifically so much as I was just commenting on a show that did manage to present the material discreetly, without any direct references.
 
Like i mentioned in the above post, just because the "standards & practices" guy that the othe shows had to deal with gave those shows more wiggle room, it doesn't mean the executive the people on this show have to deal with are as understanding.




No there isn't,it's the same freaking thing man. It's clearly not accurate history and so it's all moot.

You're still messing with history in a fictional setting either way.



Because HYDRA is probably working for the Axis? Though admitedly, that could have been made clearer, but Skull's uniform already jints at that..

Still, it seems the orginaly were going to have both the HYDRA agents and the Axis soldies, but they were told to remove them. As to why they let Skull keep the uniform, you'll have to ask the "S&P" people.
 
That really doesn't resolve the problem though, it just shifts the blame. A good S&P exec like the ones on Gargoyles or the DCAU shows would have found some way to compromise with the creative team on this issue.



It's a question of degree, it's the difference between the Lord of The Rings movies giving Arwen a bigger role then she had in the books, and completely replacing Sauron and his armies with killer cyborgs from the future.



There's no way anyone would know that from what's on screen, in fact you kinda need to ignore the expository newsreel in Meet Captain America to make that work



And I'm sure William Shatner intended Star Trek V to be a profoundly moving piece on the nature of spirituality, but I got to judge him on the movie that he actually made, not the one he imagined in his head.

And really arguing about this one short is getting us nowhere, let me just ask you one thing. Do you think superhero shows in general and other animated properties aimed at children, should be allowed depict Nazis if the story calls for it?
 
Y'know, even though the newsreel clearly shows HYDRA taking over both Germany and Italy with they conquest starting somewhere in the east and spreading west...

ya see part of the problem is that the decided to keep the HYDRA without the Axis; we are given absolutely no indication that hydra is some individual side working with axis since we are given no evidence that their IS another side to be a part of. They could have EASILY said "ever since HYDRA joined the enemy forces..." or "The enemy forces formed a special faction known as Hydra"... no it's just "the Hydra war machine" nothing more...

Part of what helped DCAU and other shows get away without referencing the nazi's is the fact they did not show any kind of alternative force at the same time, and ONLY that force
 
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