You steal a camera during MY Workshop? Fuck you, you piece of messed-up shit !

[Malthus]

when the major scientific concensus is that it absolutely does.

Read it and weep, baby. Read it and weep for your wrongness on this one.

"This program of research has shown that marijuana, when taken alone, produces a moderate degree of driving impairment which is related to the consumed THC dose. The impairment manifests itself mainly in the ability to maintain a steady lateral position on the road, but its magnitude is not exceptional in comparison with changes produced by many medicinal drugs and alcohol. Drivers under the influence of marijuana retain insight in their performance and will compensate, where they can, for example, by slowing down or increasing effort. As a consequence, THC's adverse effects on driving performance appear relatively small."

U.S. Department of Transportation,
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
(DOT HS 808 078), Final Report, November 1993:

Okay, that was from '93, but I can't see a lot changing between then and now.

That quote isn't nearly the knockout blow you appear to think it is.

It does accord with my (admittedly subjective) observations - that being light-to-moderately stoned isn't as dangerous as being the same amount of drunk, because generally the light-to-moderately stoned tend to compensate for the impairment.

That, however, acknowledges that there *is* a degree of 'impairment', of course.

There comes a point, as anyone who has smoked a lot of weed ought to know, where one is simply too stoned to 'compensate' any more. Hell, I've been too stoned to walk to the door, let alone drive!

 

[JThunder]

...it wouldn't have impaired ME, but that's just me....

Famous last words, worthy of the Darwin Awards.

 

[Mr. Excellent]

Sure. Studies show that pot does not impair driving.

Some may. The study mhendo cited suggests that pot does impair both cognitive and motor skills. Which is correct? Damned if I know - but given that there are decent studies that show *talking on a cell phone* can be a dangerous distraction in a car, it seems odd to be cavalier about the risk of driving while stoned.

This has nothing to do with legalization, by the way. I fully support absolute legalization of marijuana for recreational use - just not while driving. Treat it like alcohol.

 

[marochko]

This pothead is a total moron! Why not just steal the surveillance camera instead?

 

[Turek]

And you are welcome to doubt it. Meanwhile you have 2 - yes, 2! - people telling you from their own experience that driving under the influence of pot does not inhibit driving ability in any significant manner, and your counter-experience is... what?

We're just considering the sources.

 

[billfish678]

Thanks for the cite. I am one of those people who never seemed to suffer any impairment. My friends would often comment on it a lot that I seemed more straight when I was stoned than when I wasn't (I'm naturally kind of a space case. Pot actually seemed to clear me up and help me concentrate).

The SDMB should make it a rule that you are higher than a kite before you are allowed to post then.

And, are you related to the boozer that loves to tell people he is the hit of the party when he's drunk?

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Read it and weep, baby. Read it and weep for your wrongness on this one.

"This program of research has shown that marijuana, when taken alone, produces a moderate degree of driving impairment which is related to the consumed THC dose. The impairment manifests itself mainly in the ability to maintain a steady lateral position on the road, but its magnitude is not exceptional in comparison with changes produced by many medicinal drugs and alcohol. Drivers under the influence of marijuana retain insight in their performance and will compensate, where they can, for example, by slowing down or increasing effort. As a consequence, THC's adverse effects on driving performance appear relatively small."

You realize that even the chunk you cited proves my point, right?
1.) "This program of research has shown that marijuana, when taken alone, produces a moderate degree of driving impairment which is related to the consumed THC dose." There is impairment.
2.) "The impairment manifests itself mainly in the ability to maintain a steady lateral position on the road" It manifests in at least one measurable and demonstrable way.
3.) "Drivers under the influence of marijuana retain insight in their performance and will compensate, where they can, for example, by slowing down or increasing effort." The fact that they're compensating for the effects doesn't mean it doesn't exist; in fact, it proves it, for you can't compensate for a nonexistent effect.

You will note that I have not stated that smoking pot will make you a bad or a dangerous driver; I've simply asserted that it can and does have an effect on your ability to drive.

Except it really doesn't because the "impairment" is not significant enough to make accidents any more likely.

 

[Cat Whisperer]

Well, he posted in that thread at 3:47 today...

I see; I also see he posted in that thread even earlier, too (my research skills are apparently somewhat lacking). Oh well. Maybe he just hates this thread.

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

...it wouldn't have impaired ME, but that's just me....

Famous last words, worthy of the Darwin Awards.

From the study cited by mhendo:

there are some users who show little or no effect from using the drug. This is generally explained by a combination of genetic predisposition (i.e., some people seem to have a sort of natural resistance to the effects) and accumulated tolerance (i.e., some people who smoke a lot can build up their tolerance for it, and avoid some of the worst effects).

I was one of those people. As I said upthread, one of the reasons I stopped was because it wasn't getting me high anymore.

 

[Inigo Montoya]

I haven't smoked pot in years, but if someone wants to claim that marijuana impares cognition and motor skills, that's the person who needs to bring the cite, not me.

Ok, my post as my cite. From my limited use of medical grade pot:
Hit #1: nothing
Hit #2: buzzed, a little dizzy
Hit #3: high, I really like colored lights, have to concentrate in order to walk, I won't remember this tomorrow
Hit #4: Fucked up, can't walk in a straight line, can't pour water into a glass without considerable effort, TV seems to be in half-second stop action, can't follow a movie anyway, don't remember anything from 15 minutes ago.

I've never been stoned in a situation that requires any kind of intellectual or ethical judgment so I can't say if I'd be more likely to steal stuff. But if I were an instructor I'd be incensed (heh) to find out a student was wasting a slot in one of my classes by showing up in a condition that would compromise any benefits he might get from it.

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

You probably did great in your DARE classes, didn't you? Got all the stickers and everything, I bet.

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

Cigarettes totally cause cancer, but pot doesn't make you drive into trees. Hasn't anyone else here ever smoked pot?

Cigarettes totally do not cause cancer. I smoked cigarettes a couple of times when I was in college. And I don't have cancer.

That's right, I AM the evidence.

Can "The Evidence" be my rapper name? I call dibs.

What do you say to all the studies that show that stoned driving does not have any more likelihood than average of causing an accident? There is a great deal of evidence that smoking causes cancer. There is NO evidence that driving stoned causes car accidents.

 

[Jackmannii]

Sure. Studies show that pot does not impair driving.

And what studies might those be? A quick search finds ample evidence otherwise.

"A meta-analysis of approximately 60 experimental studies, including laboratory, driving simulator, and on-road experiments, found that behavioral and cognitive skills related to driving performance were impaired in a dose-dependent fashion with increasing THC blood levels.

Evidence from both real and simulated driving studies indicates that marijuana can negatively affect a driver's attentiveness, perception of time and speed, and the ability to draw on information obtained from past experiences.

A study of over 3000 fatally-injured drivers in Australia showed that when marijuana was present in the blood of the driver they were much more likely to be at fault for the accident. And the higher the THC concentration, the more likely they were to be culpable."

 

[Guinastasia]

Perhaps Dio was smoking some really, really shitty weed?

 

[billfish678]

Oh, by the way, based upon my personal experiences of my own body, 100% of the human population has penises. Just thought I'd let you know that the biology books are wrong.

I've gone one of them there penis thingys as well, so make that 200%.

 

[ivan astikov]

You will note that I have not stated that smoking pot will make you a bad or a dangerous driver; I've simply asserted that it can and does have an effect on your ability to drive.

You fucking retard.

Yes, it does have an effect, as noticed by the Australians 5 years later. It makes drivers slightly safer than non-drug users.

You senseless fucking witch.

 

[JThunder]

Yes, I fully accept that certain people believe that they are among the ones who would remain unaffected.

 

[Jackmannii]

To be fair, I'd say "marijuana intoxication makes one more likely to steal" is what needs a cite. Fuck if I've ever heard of such a thing.

In general it's difficult to link drug use to criminal activity given all the complicating factors leading people to commit crimes, the lack of standardization in defining a "drug crime" and limited measurements of drug levels in people committing crimes.

What we do know is that pot is one of the drugs that increases impulsivity, and it's not a big stretch to get to the concept that in some people that will include a greater propensity to break the law.

(by the way, I'm not big on the idea that pot use needs to be criminalized, but neither is it absolutely harmless like some folks would have us believe).

 

[ivan astikov]

Can we accept that pot might impair task management when it comes to navigating a maze, or sorting out different coloured plastic objects into little piles, ie. "WTF am I doing this for?" tasks, but for flying a plane, driving a car, or even mountain-biking, it might actually help your concentration?

 

[Bryan Ekers]

The guy's simply not a thief IRL

Does he watch PBS without pledging?