I believe that the War on Terror in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the middle East in general, is a farce. I'm fully open to any opposing viewpoints, and welcome them, but I'd just like to state why I see it as a farce. For one, much of the current fighting was kicked off by 9/11, although there was war on a small scale before that and the Gulf Wars before that. But right now, my focus is the current War on Terror. Take 9/11, the beginning, into account. In one instant, over 3,000 people perished in a tragic attack. This is certainly cause enough for war, however it must be looked at objectively. 3,000 people is certainly a tragedy, but neither the largest attack on American soil as many claim, nor America's biggest tragedy. Both of those titles rightly go to Pearl Harbor.
This established, you also have to take into account how many Middle Easterners the United States armies have killed over the past years. 3,000 of our innocent in one day, versus, according to this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_on_Terror#Casualties at the minimum, 80,530 innocents died in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Somalia alone. That's the bare minimum. Estimates go up to as high as over 1 million in Iraq and 50,000 in Afghanistan. A million is almost certainly an overstatement, but even a third of that is a massive number of deaths, of people who were nothing but innocents going about their daily lives. It is also said that there are a very few number of actual terrorists in the middle east, under 1% of the total population.
In effect, we are killing tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people, to kill a very small minority. However this only takes into account death tolls, which are all estimates and do not have enough firmly grounded fact to base an entire argument on. There is also the sharp decrease of quality of life. Before the assassination of Saddam Hussein, before the American invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, the middle east was relatively peaceful. There were no massive and large scale conflicts, and leaders were cruel but effective. After 9/11 and the subsequent invasions by American forces, we demolished the first era of again, relative, peace and prosperity in the middle east.
When we deposed their entire political system, we also ruined the economic system as well. Quality of life for all of those living in the middle east took a sharp downturn. Before the wars, most had running water and electricity, stable jobs, adequate housing. According to the CIA world factbook, almost a third of the population of both Iraq and Afghanistan are currently deprived of both. The average GDP per capita in Afghanistan is now only $800 US dollars, compared to our massive $46,000.
Another point to make is that we forced our 21st century government, economics, and culture on them. Looking at Afghanistan and Iraq objectively, half the country lives in the 1500's, and the other half in the 1700's but with electricity and running water. The society, and I do not mean to be offensive, is not yet stable and developed enough to support anything other than dictatorships. Especially if forced upon them. One of the biggest and most common things you hear from the people living there in Iraq and Afghanistan, is "We wish they would all just leave us be".
Which brings me to my final point. The farcical aspect. Have we not, over nearly ten years, caused more suffering and terror, yes terror, in the middle east than they ever have, or ever could, cause us? Have we not, because of the horrible things we have done in the name of eliminating a minority, in the name of spreading democracy, in the name of a better tomorrow, become terrorists ourselves? Think about it. We, as a people, have backed the government for a long time on the War on Terror, over the deaths of 3,000 people and destruction of two buildings. Yes, it was a tragedy. Yes, response was required. But in our response, we have become just like those we seek to eliminate. And that is unacceptable. That is not the true American way.
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough, intelligent, thoughtful, and knowledgable answers only. Thank you.
@Dan, pretty much irrelevant, but nonetheless it's an indicator of deep problems within American government and how we handled the entire terror threat.
@S. R. The war on drugs was going to be my next topic, and I'm taking a similar stance. It's all a farce, most drugs do very little to harm anyone but the users, and many people use drugs just BECAUSE it's illegal and for no other reason. If it's not a way to rebel, the market for narcotics will slowly die on it's own terms.
@linuleb7 You're forgetting that Pearl Harbor was a massive impact on the American Navy, and that many many ships were sunk. True, the death toll was lower, but it had a much more significant impact on shaping the short and long term future of America, and therefore it was a much more devastating attack. At no point did I ever claim that a death toll alone was the most important factor in devastation, in fact I made exactly the opposite point as nearly all large death tolls are estimates. Also, there were in fact conflicts the United States was involved in in the middle east pre-9/11, in fact dating back to 1985. Google/Wikipedia it. There is a lot of information out there if you take the time to look for it.
@The Rightly Guided; You had me until the God thing. Let's say for argument's sake, He exists. He's doing a crap job of maintaining world order. I really can't see the existence of a higher power when He, or She or They as the case may be, don't have the common courtesy to maintain world order, peace, and prosperity. Yes, I have read the Bible. Cover to cover, actually. The old testament specifically states out God's duties to people, and the people's to God. Neither side has upheld their end of the bargain, and therefore, saying that He or any other similar power exists, they are null and void anyway.
This established, you also have to take into account how many Middle Easterners the United States armies have killed over the past years. 3,000 of our innocent in one day, versus, according to this page: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_on_Terror#Casualties at the minimum, 80,530 innocents died in Iraq, Afghanistan, and Somalia alone. That's the bare minimum. Estimates go up to as high as over 1 million in Iraq and 50,000 in Afghanistan. A million is almost certainly an overstatement, but even a third of that is a massive number of deaths, of people who were nothing but innocents going about their daily lives. It is also said that there are a very few number of actual terrorists in the middle east, under 1% of the total population.
In effect, we are killing tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of people, to kill a very small minority. However this only takes into account death tolls, which are all estimates and do not have enough firmly grounded fact to base an entire argument on. There is also the sharp decrease of quality of life. Before the assassination of Saddam Hussein, before the American invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan, the middle east was relatively peaceful. There were no massive and large scale conflicts, and leaders were cruel but effective. After 9/11 and the subsequent invasions by American forces, we demolished the first era of again, relative, peace and prosperity in the middle east.
When we deposed their entire political system, we also ruined the economic system as well. Quality of life for all of those living in the middle east took a sharp downturn. Before the wars, most had running water and electricity, stable jobs, adequate housing. According to the CIA world factbook, almost a third of the population of both Iraq and Afghanistan are currently deprived of both. The average GDP per capita in Afghanistan is now only $800 US dollars, compared to our massive $46,000.
Another point to make is that we forced our 21st century government, economics, and culture on them. Looking at Afghanistan and Iraq objectively, half the country lives in the 1500's, and the other half in the 1700's but with electricity and running water. The society, and I do not mean to be offensive, is not yet stable and developed enough to support anything other than dictatorships. Especially if forced upon them. One of the biggest and most common things you hear from the people living there in Iraq and Afghanistan, is "We wish they would all just leave us be".
Which brings me to my final point. The farcical aspect. Have we not, over nearly ten years, caused more suffering and terror, yes terror, in the middle east than they ever have, or ever could, cause us? Have we not, because of the horrible things we have done in the name of eliminating a minority, in the name of spreading democracy, in the name of a better tomorrow, become terrorists ourselves? Think about it. We, as a people, have backed the government for a long time on the War on Terror, over the deaths of 3,000 people and destruction of two buildings. Yes, it was a tragedy. Yes, response was required. But in our response, we have become just like those we seek to eliminate. And that is unacceptable. That is not the true American way.
I'm sorry if I wasn't clear enough, intelligent, thoughtful, and knowledgable answers only. Thank you.
@Dan, pretty much irrelevant, but nonetheless it's an indicator of deep problems within American government and how we handled the entire terror threat.
@S. R. The war on drugs was going to be my next topic, and I'm taking a similar stance. It's all a farce, most drugs do very little to harm anyone but the users, and many people use drugs just BECAUSE it's illegal and for no other reason. If it's not a way to rebel, the market for narcotics will slowly die on it's own terms.
@linuleb7 You're forgetting that Pearl Harbor was a massive impact on the American Navy, and that many many ships were sunk. True, the death toll was lower, but it had a much more significant impact on shaping the short and long term future of America, and therefore it was a much more devastating attack. At no point did I ever claim that a death toll alone was the most important factor in devastation, in fact I made exactly the opposite point as nearly all large death tolls are estimates. Also, there were in fact conflicts the United States was involved in in the middle east pre-9/11, in fact dating back to 1985. Google/Wikipedia it. There is a lot of information out there if you take the time to look for it.
@The Rightly Guided; You had me until the God thing. Let's say for argument's sake, He exists. He's doing a crap job of maintaining world order. I really can't see the existence of a higher power when He, or She or They as the case may be, don't have the common courtesy to maintain world order, peace, and prosperity. Yes, I have read the Bible. Cover to cover, actually. The old testament specifically states out God's duties to people, and the people's to God. Neither side has upheld their end of the bargain, and therefore, saying that He or any other similar power exists, they are null and void anyway.