Toon Zone Talkback - "Toon Zone Throwdown" Top 5 Event

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This is the talkback thread for Toon Zone Throwdown Round 1: Bare-Knuckle Brawls.

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We're ripping it up for Kung Fu Panda and the Hulk movie with 5 Top 5 lists this week. Got something to say about our picks? Bring it on...clearly we love a good (conforming to the Toon Zone Forum terms of service) fight!

Hajime!!
 
It was.

Wow, I have to see Char's Counterattack and Porco Rosso someday. Now, do you have to be a reporter to of been able to come up with candidates for the lists?
 
Additionally, I wish to say I'm proud of my cohorts' long hours placed into this project. I know I surely never would have wanted to do this on my own.

But I swear, the blood stains found on their keyboards were brought upon by their own feverish will to write...serious...no whips were nessecary. ;)
 
You do, indeed, need to see Porco Rosso. It and Totoro are probably the Miyazaki movies I can watch repeatedly and still enjoy every time I see it. My advice is also to hit the French soundtrack, since Jean Reno does the voice of Porco and it's perfect. I was hoping he'd do the English dub, too, but instead we got the passable Michael Keaton.

Our process for selecting the fights was mostly a discussion thread amongst the news staff once Jacob came up with the concept. We like surprising you guys with these things, and polling amongst the general forum would have ruined the surprise. Plus, there were even a few (friendly) fights amongst the staff over what would make the lists and what wouldn't, especially when it was going to be a single "Top 5 Fights" article rather than the week-long event it turned into. We might have gotten some more interesting ideas by polling the forums, but we had too many candidates to deal with just amongst ourselves!

Every article got a "head writer" who was the final arbiter of what made that list's top 5 amongst the many worthy candidates. Thus, our super-scientific method for selecting the winning fights was, in many cases, "the head writer thought that one was cooler."

If you have ideas for other Top 5's, feel free to PM a News Staffer about it or use the News Submission form if you've got an idea. We don't want to turn the OpEd section into just a bunch of Top 5 lists, but we think they're fun, fast ways to start discussion.

-- Ed
 
I can guess who wrote the Char's Counterattack entry. A worthy choice.

I'm impressed Watership Down got remembered. Lord, yet another cartoon from days long past, I should Netflix that and see it again.

I'm glad Superman vs. Darkseid did not make the list. If another JLU fight were going to make it, Superman vs. Captain Marvel in Clash deserves it far more. Also, Superman Doomsday did a hell of a job on its own titanic clash.
 
I had to chance to see Porco, with it being on after, ironically, Totoro, when TCM was airing it's Month of Miyazaki, but passed on it becuase I just wanted to go to bed. Gotsta rent it now.

You know, if I were to of picked any Supes vs. Darkseid brawl, I would of gone with theirs in "Legacy, part 2" in a heartbeat. I thought it was far more epic than "Destroyer"'s, and Darkseid's speech at the end proved even more so.

Knowing Ed Liu's working on this, I'm expecting some Avatar on future lists, but which battle is the question. Probably some Aang vs. Zuko for sure.

*prays Jack vs. Dark Jack or Yusuke vs. Toguro make it somewhere*
 
Absolutely. One of the key aims was to throw a few surprises in there rather than just roll out the obvious and Watership Down's brawl is memorable and full of ick. Especially the noise of tearing rabbit ears.
 
Jeez! Watership Down looks INTENSE! I mean, I've heard it scarred some children, but I always took that as witty banter... gotta see it, now! :p

And I'm excited to see Porco Rosso on the list. One of my favorite Miyazaki films, and the entire final battle, in the planes and in the water, is one of my favorite parts. Beautiful film, all around... great balance between silly and serious.
 
I definatly agree with 'Clash' should have been included. Hell of a fight no matter what your view of JLU might have been.

I'd like to toss out a Honerable Mention to the Optimus Prime/Megatron fight in the 1986 TF: Animated movie. It was short, but from the moment Prime rolled out over that bridge (to the tune of The Touch) until the Decepticons retreated it was a savage contest between two old enemies who both knew that this was their final meeting.
 
Wow. Watership Down looks way too intense for me. Seeing rabbits pretty much try to kill each other goes pretty far outside of my comfort zone for violence. Dang, the punches in Porco Rosso look like they're in pwned style. Interesting, but also a tad outside of my comfort zone. It is cool to see some JLU that made the cut. Now those are within my comfort zone. I also agree that the fight between Superman and Darkseid shouldn't be on the list just because Darkseid kept on getting up, despite Superman's efforts to keep him down, and he's only stopped by Lex anyway. That was really intense to watch, but the end of the fight was kind of weird, in a way. Interesting list of fight moments.
 
I think what gets me the most about the Char/Amuro battle in CCA is just how much they want to kill each other. Sure, they try to protect their assets (Axis for Char, his crewmates/Earth for Amuro), but they just plain wanna kill each other. I particularly liked when they got out of the Mobile Suits and starting using rocket launchers, complete with radio deceptions and Newtype skillz, against each other, culminating in a beatdown by the awesome Nu Gundam. All the while Amuro and Char are basically shouting more eloquent versions of "You suck!" "No, YOU suck!" "No, YOU suck even more!" at each other.
 
Ding! Round 2 has begun!

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Porco Rosso is well short of even JLU levels of violence. Despite how the shots look, it's mostly played for comedy.

Watership Down, on the other hand, does get shockingly violent. Fabulous movie, but definitely not one for the squeamish.

-- Ed
 
Ah, I've always loved the black vs. white battle in "XL". It really is one of the most stunning scenes of animation I've had the honor to see this decade, but I'm shocked you picked Anakin vs. Asajj in favor of Grevious' first battle in Clone Wars. You just can't beat that.
 
This list intrigued me into watching Watership Down and I must say it was a very brilliant movie. And now that I watched that I've moved on to Plague Dogs, which I haven't finished watching yet, but already find great.
 
I wouldn't say use of a giant robots counts as a bare fisted fight... still that was a good fight.

I must admit I'm shocked and slightly mad that there was no Dragonball/DBZ fight in the first fights winners. There are some legendary fights in that series. Though I suppose their might be a uh... "beat downs" top 5?

Still, a good list both it and the duels list.
 
DBZ fights use energy beams, teleportation (or something close to it), energy auras, and other such wizardry. Therefore, it is ineligible from the "Bare-Knuckle Brawls" category. Yes, there were powers used in the JLU fights, by they were all used for physical combat. If, say, Zatana had fought in the episode and used her magic, or if Star Sapphire was in the fight, then that brawl would have been ineligible (and the spot would've probably gone to Supes vs. Captain Marvel).
 
I can't speak for James, but I prefer the Anakin vs. Asajj duel mostly because it has a lot more importance in the grand scheme of things. You see Anakin slowly slip over to the Dark Side as the fight goes on, but the difference between this and, say, killing the Tusken Raiders in the second movie is that the movie can be viewed as getting caught up in the passion of the moment. Here, Anakin seems to know he's doing it and he doesn't care. No (painfully bad) speech of remorse after it's done. It makes his victory completely hollow because we know what the consequences will be. It's another instance of "character development through fighting."

Gen. Grievous vs. a pile of Jedi is a magnificent fight, but ultimately, it's just a display of bad-assery. A thrilling, terrifically choreographed display of bad-assery, but just that in the end.



To reiterate Duke's point, the emphasis in Round 1 was Fists and Feet in Faces. The Gundam fight ultimately degenerates into that, but the average DBZ fight is so much more. The Hulk and the Thing have super-powers, but those powers only let them hit things harder. This is also why nothing from Avatar shows up there, since bending is never about FnFiF.

Fear not, though -- still 3 days and 3 more lists left ;).

-- Ed
 
Must. Restrain. Manicle. Laughter. About. Next. List.

MUWAHHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!


Oh Ed, you and your love of the term FnFiF. I hope Goodwife Liu is not easy to envy. :p
 
It depends what quantifies as a great duel. Personally, I think there are many different quantifiers - and I think Anakin versus Asajj is a good example of an animated duel that really places the emphasis on how a good duel isn't about taking things to the kick-ass limit, but creating a great fight that relies on the nuances to make it great. For me it's the textures of sound, pace, geography - and as Ed pointed out - character that make this a worthy inclusion; an example of how vital direction is to a great long duel.
 
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