Toon Zone Talkback - "The Simpsons" Season 12: Not the Worst Season Ever, But Far From the Best

That "badger" scene left a really bad taste in my mouth. They used to save the fatal woundage gags exclusively for Halloween episodes, but by using those kind of gross-out jokes consistently, it just devalued the series as a whole. It used to be enough just to have Homer get hit on the head with a mallet by Maggie, but now we have to have him smash the glass case of a jukebox, then hold out his bleeding, lacerated hand and exclaim "Ooooo, hemmorage-a-mundo!" :mad:
 
Now that you mention it, the show has gotten a lot bloodier/more violent.

Homer getting his arm cut up with the spinning blade of a robot. Homer getting shot in the arm and picking out the bullet with a knife. :eek: Both of those examples were from Season 15, by the way.

It's like they were attempting to mimic South Park's shock humor but failing miserably.
 
I just bought Season 12 yesterday, and I thought I'd provide my opinions on what I've seen so far. I haven't done this in a while, but since I haven't seen Season 12 in so long, I'd like to see if my views of each episode have changed since then.

- "Treehouse of Horror XI": One of Mike Scully's bigger weaknesses that I've seen was pacing. He tried to cram too much into his episodes, and so everything seems to be running at double speed. The first time I noticed it this season was right at the beginning of the first episode, as "G-G-Ghost D-D-Dad" seems to rocket along without ever slowing down, and it kills some otherwise potentially funny bits. (Though I'll admit, "Do you really have to talk like that?" "No, not really" got a laugh out of me.) "Scary Tales Can Come True" isn't particularly Halloween-y, but its timing seems to be a little sharper for the most part. "Night of the Dolphin" is generally considered the centerpiece of this episode, and for good reason, as it's undoubtedly the strongest of the three stories. The biggest laugh of the episode came from this segment ("Snorky...talk...man...(ahem) I'm sorry, let me start over..."). Kang and Kodos' ending scene was a clever bit of self-parody, too.

- "A Tale of Two Springfields": How come both milestone episodes from the Scully era have Homer acting like an unlikeable jerk in a position of authority? "Trash of the Titans" from Season 9 made for a very disappointing 200th episode, and this doesn't fare much better as the 250th. The funniest stuff comes at the beginning with the badger in Santa's Little Helper's doghouse, but even that gives us the uncomfortable visual of Homer's chest ripped open. Save that stuff for the Halloween episodes, guys. Once things progress to the town meeting between the 636 area code residents and the 939ers, things start to go downhill fast. Phoney McRingRing only serves to remind me how much I miss Phil Hartman as Troy McClure (though that's no fault of the writers), and Homer planning to suicide-bomb the town hall if he doesn't get his old area code back is pretty extreme, even for this show, and a prime example of Homer's weaker characterization in later seasons. Once we get to the Who, Homer has become a real jerkass, and the closing scene of him chloroforming Marge has always rubbed me the wrong way.

- "Insane Clown Poppy": I'm sorry, shouldn't this episode have some emotional resonance? I barely even noticed that Krusty had reunited with his long-lost daughter. There's so much potential for an idea like that, but instead, it's condensed into a handful of scenes in Act II, sandwiched between an Act I completely wasted on fireworks and a book festival, and an Act III that has Homer and Krusty infiltrating Fat Tony's mansion during a mafia summit. Even without looking at the production code (BABF17), I could tell you this was a holdover from the ADD-riddled Season 11. Also, this episode has one of the weakest "celebrity" guest voices ever, as they got John Updike just to say his name and laugh. Really, guys, you don't need to prove that you can get anyone on this show; we believe you.

- "Lisa the Tree Hugger": This certainly isn't a bad episode, but it's no classic either. It just...exists. Again, the idea of Lisa joining a radical pro-environment group and being overwhelmed by their extremism has the potential to be great, but the jokes don't hold up too well. They're not bad jokes, they just don't connect the way they should. It might be the timing, or it might be the delivery, but something about this episode is off.

- "Homer Vs. Dignity": Ouch. This one hurt. While I'll admit it was nice to see Homer as someone a little more human with his conflict between maintaining his dignity and taking Mr. Burns' money, the source of that conflict was what sunk this episode. Mr. Burns has never struck me before as the kind of guy who likes pulling embarrassing pranks on people, and I have no idea why he's doing it in this episode. Yes, I know it's a parody of The Magic Christian, but it just doesn't click with the execution they gave it. This is a man who once blocked out the sun - why is the extent of his devilishness now limited to throwing fish guts on people? Also, it's worth mentioning that upon this viewing, I finally realized that the infamous panda scene makes absolutely no sense, even in the context of the contrived plot it's in. Homer dressing up as a panda is hardly a prank - how do the townspeople get humiliated by this? The whole thing feels like the writers' excuse to get Homer in a panda suit and then mistaken for the real deal by a horny male panda - in other words, it's painfully contrived and leads to a disgusting punchline. I'd expect this from a crappy frat-comedy movie, not "The Simpsons".

- "The Computer Wore Menace Shoes": Now this one I actually liked. Which is surprising, 'cause the last time I watched it, I thought it was pretty lame. Admittedly, it takes a sharp left turn in the third act, but now that I know what "The Prisoner" is, it does help to take some of the confusion away. The humor is still pretty strong, the pacing isn't too bad, and the technological jokes actually still hold up pretty well nine years later.

- "The Great Money Caper": Another one that surprised me. I used to hate this episode with a passion, but now that I understand the source material (movies like The Sting and Paper Moon), it makes a bit more sense. A lot of jokes made me laugh harder than they used to ("I'd like to, son, but we already left the gift shop!...D'OH!"), though the non-ending still feels a little awkward. It's pretty similar to the previous season's "Missionary: Impossible", and it's okay to pull that once, but twice does get a little tedious.

- "Skinner's Sense of Snow": Much like Speedy, I'm surprised this plot hadn't been done before. It's a great idea to have the kids trapped in the school with Principal Skinner, and as such, this is one of the funnier and more organic-feeling episodes of the season. None of the humor feels forced, as it all comes from the kids' interactions with Skinner. The subplot of Homer and Flanders trying to save the kids is also quite well done, with a funny callback to "Mr. Plow" to boot. There's some surprisingly risque jokes here and there ("That's the last time you'll slap your Willie around!", "You made it, Nibbles! Now, chew through my ball sack!", etc.), but they don't distract from the overall strength of the episode.

- "HOMR": Scully's pacing issues come back in full-force with this one, as the main plot point doesn't kick in until halfway through the episode. Thankfully, it's made up for by the animation convention set piece at the beginning, which offers some pretty funny jabs that animation fans like myself will get (the nonsensical qualities of anime, voice actors who just rip off other voices, etc.). Once we get to Homer's increased intelligence, though, something feels off. Homer does smarter things, sure, but you don't really feel that he is smarter. He still talks and feels like the same old bumbling oaf he was before, and it doesn't offer enough contrast between him and the rest of the town. The bond he develops with Lisa is also rushed and slipshod, and the payoff at the end with the note he wrote lacks the punch it needs to connect. A potentially good idea, but executed poorly. (Also, it feels weird for Moe to be the surgeon who puts the crayon back in Homer's brain. I still say it should have been Dr. Nick Riviera.)

- "Pokey Mom": This is another one of those episodes that just seems to exist without being particularly memorable. Marge episodes in the Scully era seem to have that problem a lot, as nobody on his staff really knew how to write for her. There's not much for me to say about her and Jack Crowley, nor can I think of much I liked in the subplot of Homer becoming an amateur chiropractor. This B-plot feels like they were trying to recapture the same spontaneity of Homer's sugar pile from "Lisa's Rival", but it lacks the clever humor required to pull off such a non-sequitur subplot like that.
 
Toon Zone Talkback - "The Simpsons" Season 12: Not the Worst Season Ever, But Far From the Best

Season 12, the second best season of the Scully era, IMo, is still a turd. By this time of it's original run, it was apppearnt the Simpsons smart, subtle side was dead and gone and replaced by the Wacky Antics of Homer and his loyal family.

One of the most noteable offenders in S12 was the grossely overrated "HOMR." This review in 2001 summed it up best:

"It may not be the most original insight to be preached to us, but then, what
are we to expect from mere television? Anti-intellectualism is so pervasive in
America today that given the choice one would rather be an idiot than see
things as they really are, and "HOMR" proves it. Unfortunately, it doesn't
prove it by having Homer become a genius, see that the world is no place for
the brainy, and choose to return to his prior state of ignorance. Rather,
"HOMR" fully distorts what it means to be a thinking person in an idiot's
world, and it's clear that it does so for the convenience of the people in the
audience who would like nothing more from television than to watch a sitcom,
laugh, then forget all about it by the time the credits have finished rolling.
"HOMR" claims to be deriding our anti-intelligence culture, but at the same
time, it's cheerfully feeding it.

"HOMR" trots out nearly every "intelligence" clich? in the book. Homer wears
a cardigan - because smart people wear cardigans! Homer uses big words -
because smart people use big words! Homer listens to piano compositions -
because no self-respecting smart person would listen to rock music! And of
course his IQ went through the roof? Even though it's pretty much widely
recognized that one's IQ is irrelevant to their "intelligence." This isn't a
smart person; it's a stupid person's idea of what a smart person is (much like
"Malcolm in the Middle"). In reality, "HOMR" presents nothing more challenging
to the audience than your average sitcom. At the animation festival in the
first act, for example, they could've satirized the fact that so much of
today's animation is obsessed with envelope-pushing humor, and there's little
out there for people looking for something less tired."


Also, I feel that the only two episodes worth watching over, much less buying a DVD 'set' for were "Hungry, Hungry Homer" and "Trilogy of Error." Suprisingly, HHH was a relativiely sweet episode (for the Scully Era) and ToE was a rather ambitious outting that actually was quite entertaining.

As for the rest of S12, it could dissappear off the face of the planet and I woudn't loose any sleep and if I want wacky Simpsons humor that doesn't forget it's the Simpsons, I'll go with Mirkin's work. As far as I'm concerned, Scully's tenure is nothing more than the Mirkin era with 3/4ths of its brains removed. Ironically, the S12 holdover in S13 was called "The Blunder Years."
 
I disagree, I thought Trash of The Titans was hilarious. Plus its not like Sweet Seymour Skinner's Badass Song wasn't overshadowed by stronger outings in Season 5. Not that that episode wasn't good, but I thought there were stronger episodes in that season.
Same goes for Trash of The Titans in Season 9 IMO.
 
Oh me too, in a heartbeat. The Mirkin years were far more consistently funny, for one thing. And it still had a heart amidst the zaniness. "Lisa on Ice", for example, has a pretty sweet ending (Bart and Lisa remembering all the good things they did for each other as young kids and making up on the rink) amidst all the rioting carnage. And that's just one example.

Unrelated, but I just remembered, having rewatched Naked Gun recently, that "Homer in the bathroom" mo-cap scene from "HOMR" is very similar to Leslie Nielsen's "grunt noises heard from the bathroom because his mic is still on" scene in Naked Gun. Granted, they're not exactly the same and I'm not implying Jean stole that joke, but it was definitely deja vu.
 
I sat though some of the so called "Worst" episodes like "Kill the alagator and run" and actually enjoyed them to an extend. It was not until "Homer vs. Dignity" and the Panda scene that I actuallt began to lose faith in The Simpsons. So much so that I no longer use the phrase "Jump the shark" to represent a shows low point, but "Panda raped" even if it does not have the same lasting power.

That being said there are some episodes of this season that I enjoy, but I still see this as my least favorite season.
 
Toon Zone Talkback - "The Simpsons" Season 12: Not the Worst Season Ever, But Far From the Best

Finished the set now, so here's the rest of my thoughts:

- "Worst Episode Ever": An episode all about the Comic Book Guy doesn't seem like it should work, but this is actually one of the funnier offerings from this season. Hank Azaria's voice acting really helps to put this one over the top. Plus, Bart and Milhouse running the store together makes for some great character interaction.

- "Tennis the Menace": Despite the self-parodying left turn in act one, this is actually a fairly reserved episode. There's not too much off-the-scale wackiness, but there's not too much hilarious humor either. It's a pretty average episode, with flashes of greatness here and there ("I guess you could say I'm Iraqi!" "*gasp* Get off my property!").

- "Day of the Jackanapes": For a Sideshow Bob episode, this doesn't feel quite as engaging or explosive as the previous capers. Again, though, there are isolated moments of funny ("Krusty? But that's the one man I'd never kill!"), and the network executive stuff always makes me laugh. The ending really hocked me off the first time I saw it, but now that I know Bob's not dead, I've loosened up a lot about it. I kinda wish they'd kept the deleted scene with Sideshow Mel, though.

- "New Kids on the Blecch": Man, did they ever drop the ball with this one. The boy band fad seems like something custom-made for "The Simpsons" to make fun of, but after about half an act of passable jabs at the music industry, it morphs into Lisa uncovering a subliminal Navy recruitment scheme. And when Act III ends with Lt. Smash bombing the offices of MAD Magazine, all I can do is scratch my head and wonder "How did we end up here?" Lots of wasted potential. Still, guest stars who are willing to make fun of themselves are always welcome, so the N'Sync scenes weren't as bad as they could have been ("We gotta go, our clothes are getting a little bit out of style").

- "Hungry Hungry Homer": This is probably one of the best episodes of the Scully era, and for good reason - it has Homer behaving at his most human in a long time, actually thinking of people other than himself and standing up for the little guy. It almost feels like something that might have been done in Season 7 or 8. Plus, the humor is surprisingly strong ("I gave that man directions, even though I didn't know the way! 'Cause that's the kind of guy I am this week!"). A welcome change of pace from the jackass food monster that Homer was so infamous for turning into by this point.

- "Bye Bye Nerdie": Episodes at the school tend to be my favorites, and this one is helped not only by a lot of strong writing, but also by Lauren MacMullan's cinematic direction. A lot of shadows, a lot of unique camera angles (I love the up shot from the floor after Francine spits out the head of Lisa's Malibu Stacy doll), and a lot of nice fluid animation. This one's not just fun to watch, it's fun to look at, too! The subplot with Homer as a baby-proofer is also pleasantly entertaining, even if Maggie nail-gunning Homer's hands to the wall is a little disturbing. (It helps that there's no blood, though - in an era of overly-graphic physical injury gags, that's some nice restraint on their behalf.)

- "Simpson Safari": Hm, a mediocre outing, to be sure. These episodes where the writers make fun of the fan complaints are always very delicate territory. This time, they took jabs at the family vacation episodes, disjointed Act I setpieces, and Lisa's tendency to over-explain everything. Some of it works ("I think we should look at her research before we condemn her entirely!...I haven't said anything for a while"), some of it doesn't ("I mean, I knew scientists wasted their lives, but geez!"). Still, it's definitely not the fabled "worst episode ever", as a number of fans have billed it.

- "Trilogy of Error": If "Hungry Hungry Homer" is one of the best of the Scully era, then this is the best, hands down. Even if you haven't seen Go or Run Lola Run, this is a great concept episode. The way the three stories interlock with each other is incredible, and the real fun comes from gradually piecing it all together as you watch it. It helps that the writing is solidly funny throughout ("You'll burn for this! Burn in jail!", "Symmetry, eh?", "What's it like riding a girl's bike?" "It's disturbingly comfortable", etc.). Also, Linguo is really funny. "Shut up your face."

- "I'm Goin' to Praiseland": There's a complaint that this episode tries for emotional resonance and fails, but personally, I don't think it did too bad of a job. The first act is a little extreme, but once we get to the Praiseland plot thread, things take a sharp upturn. I like the townspeople's reaction to the park ("You can stop Satan with your faith!" "My face?! Are you calling me ugly?" "No, no, I think you're beautiful!" "Oh, that's it!"), and the hallucinations of heaven are really nicely done. After seeing the original ending in the deleted scenes, the actual ending seems that much better - I'm glad they exercised the restraint to actually not have the park explode. Instead, we're given a nice low-key ending with Rachel and Flanders that's much more satisfying.

- "Children of a Lesser Clod": This one's hard to define. Homer's kind of a jerk to Bart and Lisa, but he's not doing it on purpose as we've seen him do in other Scully episodes. He's merely been caught up in the fun of running a daycare, so I can forgive his oblivious behavior here. There's a lot of good solid laughs here. The opening set piece with the YMCA, Homer's morphine story, Bill Cosby rambling about Pok?mon, Arnie Pie vs. Kent Brockman ("I can't see through metal, Kent!") - all really very funny. Still, I must agree with the general consensus that Homer's scab healing over Ralph's hand is pretty disgusting.

- "Simpsons Tall Tales": Nowadays, when these three-story episodes pop up two or three times a season, it's hard to remember a time when they hadn't worn out their welcome. But this one's actually pretty good. Homer as Paul Bunyan is a very solid outing ("When are we gonna...y'know..." "Oh, soon! I just need a few more yoga classes"). I admit, Big Holes With Beer National Park always makes me laugh. Connie Appleseed is probably the weakest of the three, but it's still very entertaining. And again, the last story is the best one, with Bart and Nelson as Tom Sawyer and Huck Finn. Nancy Cartwright's brilliant voice acting comes through in spades here, and it helps that the writing skewers all those Southern-style Twainisms while still staying decidedly Simpsonian. The "tackback/backtack" conversation is a brilliant bit of work.

Overall, Season 12 starts out weak, but picks up steam as it goes along. There seems to be an effort to move away from the scattershot nature of Seasons 10 and 11, and ground the series in the characters a bit more. It takes them a while to get the hang of it, but once they work out a lot of the weaker stuff, there are laughs to be had.
 
Bah. I still say the panda rape thing is overblown. First of all, it served a purpose in the story, in that it was the most extreme example of Homer's sacrificing his dignity for much-needed cash (in other words, it wasn't just a random throwaway joke added solely for shock value), but also, they don't actually show it, so there's no evidence of Homer himself being raped (may have just been the, erm, costume). It wasn't a high brow or subtle scene so I guess you could make that argument (and I wouldn't necessarily disagree with you), but for the purposes of the story and Homer's dilemma, I thought it worked.

Besides, the scene ends with one of my favorite Moe lines: "Ha! You ain't goin' NOWHERE, cutie." I'll give you that: Ned straightening out his wife's bed imprint was a nice quiet way for him to slowly get over his wife's passing, and was been better than that over-the-top explosion would've been. But I still wonder how much better this arc would've been in, say, the Oakley/Weinstein era. Not that they were perfect saints, but they generally had a better handle on how to do this sort of thing.
 
I'd say the panda rape was just gratuitous. It really served no purpose in the story except to make a rape joke.

The actual episode itself I didn't mind, though.

I still don't think the season compares to 9 or 10, and I was really hoping the DVD set would help change my opinion of it. Unfortunately, it didn't.
 
The only episode i am really looking forward to is Worst Episode Ever: the one where Bart and Milhouse run the Comic Book Guys shop while he's in the hospital.
 
How could people think Season 12 was better than Season 10?

Season 10 was the last season with consistently funny episodes, and while you could sense the change in direction of the show, it still had a lot of the charm of Seasons 1-9 (which I consider the classic era).

I am starting to think Season 10 is being very underrated by lots of people.
 
Homer was what sunk Season 10 for me. Out of 23 episodes, he's the focus of 13 of them, and throughout much of it, he's an unlikeable jerk. In Season 12, his prominence is downplayed, and he's still kind of jerky on occasion, but there are genuine efforts to make him more human and to get the audience to stand in his corner. It's a far cry from the Homer of "Homer Simpson in: Kidney Trouble" who leaves Grampa to die on the operating table not once but twice, just so he can save his own skin, to the Homer of "Hungry Hungry Homer" who's willing to give up food, one of his favorite things in the world, in order to expose the truth about the Isotopes' impending move to Albuquerque.
 
Not only what JB Warner said was true, but for a lot of people the shock of seeing the Simpsons 'end' in S9 and become the "Homer Show" in S10 hadn't fully set in for those who saw it when it first aired. By S12, however, the show had been the same style (for better or worse) for almost three years and Season 12 might not have been so much a shock to the system as it was a massive dissapointment (and good riddence) for the Scully era.



Being as I watched the Simpsons since April 1987, I had never 'hated' the show until S10 came along. Obviously, the show had its share of hits and misses, but in ONE season everything I liked about the show changed for the worse. In season 10, the show became a vehicle for obnoxious humor centered around a head buffoon (guess which one!). Also, I'm not sure what charm the show had in S10, or if you're looking back at the show after watching all the Jean-era episodes first, or if I didn't have a Mike Scully secret joke decoder ring, but S10 was about as charming as bandsaw and it had the brains of one, too.



By whom? Obsessed fans of that other cartoony family feel an animated show be as wacky as possible and hate the 'boring' Jean era? In all honesty, I feel that the Scully years succeeded in dumbing the show down, while the past few years, the show tried to be smart, but failed.

Unfortunetly, now that 10 years have passed since the abomination known as S10, people just look back at with uber-hopless nostalgia and and love to mistake this seasons lack of wit and empathy as a work of genius.
 
No, I actually do prefer season 10, warts and all. I do think it was noticeably worse than every season before it, but there were still quite a few highlights in it. Season 11 and 12 had far less than it did, and were way more over the top wacky and insulting to the intelligence. And I did like it when it originally aired, too. But I like it a bit more upon seeing it on DVD.

I'm not saying it doesn't have it's weak episodes, but I do think season 11 and 12 have way more weak points and far less positives. For example, JB mentioned one of the handful of decent episodes the season had, with one of the worst season 10 had to offer in comparison. I could easily make the opposite case in my favor.

I think Scully should have stopped there, though. None of the other showrunners kept it going after two seasons, and there was little reason for him to, as well.
 
I havent seen much of season twelve in a long time, so I didn't really want to comment, but since it's been brought up, I'll quickly give my two cents. For some reason, I don't find season ten to be all that bad. It's the last season I was willing to purchase on DVD, although part of it is probably nostalgia. I can agree with almost all the arguments against it. It did have a lot of Homer episodes, but there were some gems buried throughout. I've always liked "Wizard of Evergreen Terrace", "Kidney Trouble", "Lisa Gets an A", and "Wild Barts Can't Be Broken". The biggest problem I had with it is that it kicked up the needless celebrity cameos into overdrive, with "When You Dish Upon A Star", and "Sunday, Cruddy, Sunday" as the main offenders. I liked it a lot better when celebrities played characters instead. Fred Willard made "Sunday" pretty pleasant.

I hope I didn't break any rules by ranting about season ten in a thread made for season twelve, and if I did, I apologize.
 
Well like I said in the review, let's remember: Celebrities playing themselves was common in the old seasons too, and certainly not exclusive to the Scully years. Remember George Harrison? Gerry Cooney? Joan Rivers? Tom Jones? All the baseball players in "Homer at the Bat"?

What matters is how they're utilized. For instance, I hated Tony Blair's guest spot in "The Regina Monologues" because he was introduced in "Look! It's Tony Blair!", and he did nothing of amusement, only pointing out things to see in England. But James Woods in "Homer and Apu" is comedy gold.

I do agree, though, that it's more interesting when celebrities play another character, like Ed Norton as the "FBI agent"/Devon Bradley, or Danny DeVito as Herb Powell.
 
I think of it more as 3 star vs. 1 star. The earlier stuff being 5 star, and season 2 and 9 being 4 star. (the first season being 3 star)

But, that's me. :p
 
Joan Rivers was never a guest star; her brief cameo in "Homer's Barbershop Quartet" was done by Dan Castellaneta. Probably the best example of a gratuitous cameo appearance from the golden age would be Dr. Joyce "I brought my own mic" Brothers in "Last Exit to Springfield".



Tony Blair's guest appearance was almost a bust for me, until Homer's last line ("Wow, I can't believe we met Mr. Bean!").
 
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