There Will Be Blood #1- When ambition meets faith

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Yes. He probably saw HW as a loss. :(

Yeah! He keeps trying and trying to be loving even when Daniel is mocking him, then Daniel breaks the news and my goodness, that was just, horrible. HW was a good kid and a good man, I'm glad he at least had his wife to go back too and start his own family. But man, that was tough as heck.
 
Hey it's not my fault, I have no one else to play with over here! It's true, though. There are people who have visited the No Country thread but this? Hardly anyone does, and I had a lot of questions/comments on the movie. So too bad, you'll have to bear the brunt of my ramblings :P

I didn't feel sorry for Eli exactly, but as I came out of the theatre people were talking about how they hated Eli for being so irritating and that '"the actor" (I felt sad that they didn't know Paul Dano's name) did "a terrible job". That's sad! Eli is supposed to be someone you dislike. He's like an annoying younger brother, only with delusions of grandeur. But that's the point, and Paul Dano did a fantastic job in portraying Eli. I mean, neither Eli nor Daniel were meant to be liked! Also I think it took a very strong portrayal of Eli not to be overwhelmed by DDL's Plainview, and Paul Dano did a marvellous job. I can't believe he only had 4 days to prepare.

That was really crazy though. Seriously, what the hell? It wasn't as abrupt as the ending of No Country though, and in the end it fit because this way you're wondering what happened to Plainview. To show him getting away with murder, or being hauled up by the cops, or killing himself - these are the three most likely possibilities - it would have been more anticlimatic. Finding out what happened would have dimmed our image of this larger-than-life character, removed the mystique a little. So that was a masterstroke by PTA!

Yeah, I felt uneasy after it ended. It doesn't leave a good taste in your mouth (but not in the way a terrible show does, I'm sure you know what I mean). I remember I was stunned as it ended, I was just sitting in my seat in the cinema staring at the screen for a short while while everyone left. It took me a while to snap back to reality and even so I felt a bit off. And my friend was laughing about the movie, only I couldn't because I didn't find it funny, and also because I was so affected by it. Ah, the power of good films.

This is the leaked final script of TWBB, if you're interested. As you can see there are a few changes (am quite glad they changed the final bit actually!) - having seen it, on one hand I want to watch it again to see the differences, but on the other I don't know when I'll be able to stomach watching it again. It's the kind of movie that takes a lot out of the viewer.
 
I think he didn't see HW as a proper human (both boy and man) after he became disabled. I don't think Daniel is someone who has much time with disabled people. Especially not a disabled man - I don't think he could respect HW after that.

I know! That was insanely good. It's like HW realises Daniel never loved him and I think that's when the emotional ties between the two of them were completely broken, once and for all - it was a significant moment.
 
Hope you like it then ;)

I know. And it's not in there, but from other interviews he's said that he initially took it up, then felt very overwhelmed and suffered from a lack of confidence in his abilities, to the point that he wanted to back out. But PTA was very encouraging and in the end he just hid behind hours and hours of music that he chucked at PTA. So as much as we adore Jonny's score (or at least I do), I think PTA also had a huge role in picking out the parts of the music that he wanted, because they were fantastic.

For the most part, yes, but it's funny that one of the scenes uses 'Convergence' which isn't in the TWBB soundtrack, it's actually from the Bodysong soundtrack (an earlier film that Jonny composed music for). It's this part, actually:

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(Although there's also 'There Will Be Blood' underneath, I only realised that just now as I was re-watching the scene.
 
Since you forced me back over here :lol:

It kind of broke my heart that Eli died :lol: I really wanted him to stand up to Daniel and he didn't. I agree that in the end Eli should have been the one who died but I would have liked to see the other way around. I loved that after the death Daniel was like "I'm finished" :lol: OMG! It totally messed me up for the rest of the night. I had to sneak into Juno after I saw it so I could calm myself!
 
m4a is perfect. Thanks again! Downloading now. :D

Great interview! :clap: I love music but I know so very little about the way its made. It's fascinating to me that musicians go through an internal process and then create what they feel. :sigh:

I love that he said he just wrote for the movie and only a few theme were specifically done for one thing. That does match with what we discussed early about the music and the movie being perfectly together. :nod:
 
Ah. I don't know. Your view makes sense. But if you avoid any allegories and just focus on the hatred as that between two men, then Daniel had always been on top and for me it makes more sense that, as he continued his descent into madness, he would end up winning as well. I don't think a man like Daniel could have not won - the entire movie portrays him as a winner, with a focus on the cost of his gains. Besides when it came to the count Daniel was always ahead and better than Eli because he was willing to go the entire length to get what he wanted. And because of that Daniel was always going to win against Eli. Eli, I think, is the same as Daniel deep down. They have the same relentless ambition, the same way of playing people, the same self-sacrifice that was needed to get what they wanted (Daniel's was the baptism, Eli's was the owning up as a charlatan). But Eli is also a snivelling weasel (the descripton just seemed apt for a reason), a coward - Daniel was a man and Eli was a boy. So for these reasons I think it was natural that if one of them had to be ultimately humiliated and to die, Eli would have been it.

That said I do love how completely out the blue it was though, the killing - I expected a lot of taunting and then... I'm not sure. Not death at any rate. Still, it messes with your head and that - craziness aside - is really great. It makes the movie so much more memorable.
 
Yeah, we agree. :nod: I think he sees in HW both opportunity and all that is right with his 'business' so he takes cares of him because he represents a way in. Plus, he was just a kid, once he became a man he was any other man that could either be fooled or destroy Daniel. Like you said, he kept repeating he was a 'bastard in a basket.' Grown up HW with his disability meant nothing to him anymore, he became just what Daniel was screaming and screaming.

It was such a heartbreaking scene when he says, "Thank God I have none of you in me," but you know he walks away fatherless and sad at the same time. The veil was lifted and his life had been a lie for a long time. So sad.
 
Exactly!

Alright, I'll PM you the score then. I hope you like it ;) Randomly, here's an interview with Jonny Greenwood, about the score for TWBB and other things... I've cut away the parts that weren't relevant. Is it OK if it's in .m4a? If you can't then there's a programme online called Switch that's very useful (but you'll have to download it)
 
Yeah you make sense. Actually I agree with you. Before I saw the movie I had read on the IMDb boards that he didn't love HW, but I saw instances where he seemed like he did. Like there was once where Daniel laid on the floor beside HW, trying to get him to soothe or something. I can't really remember, but there were one or two incidents that made me think he DID love HW. But he did leave HW on the train, which was kind of a horrible thing to do...

So here's my opinion. I think that he initially took in the child because he could use him as a prop for the "family business" claim, but after a while he developed an attachment (or at least a sense of responsibility). But after HW became deaf he lost his respect in his son and thus left him on the train. And when HW came back, he tolerated the slap because he saw HW's return as a chance to continue the whole "family business" tag. Notice that I haven't uesd the word love because I don't think he actually did - I think the most revealing scene was when he kept yelling "bastard in a basket!" - he was insane, he had no inhibition and so spoke his mind. As for threatening people who questioned his parenting skills/family, I don't think he did it because he felt guilty, I think he just didn't like people questioning him.

But I'm not sure, not really - it's difficult because I saw the movie a long time ago, I can't quite remember each exact scene :(
 
I thought that it might be a more interesting twist if Eli killed Daniel precisely of what you said. That hatred between them I felt was mainly one sided, coming the most from Daniel. Eli just took the hatred; the yelling, the hitting the humiliation for years! Then in that final scene Daniel baits him throughout all of it and humiliates him yet again, I just feel that Eli has all this pent up rage that I'm surprised he wasn't the one who killed Daniel. I think it would have made more sense for him to do it. I remember when Daniel killed Eli, I felt it really did come out of no where in way. I don't know. Maybe it's just me? :shrug:

But I did like the end of the film. It makes you leave the theater really messed up :lol:
 
Yeah that seems to be the general reaction Sasha :lol: watch it again! I think you'll like it now that you already know what happens.

Yeah, the H.W. setting fire thing makes sense. I suppose it's probably jealousy. Slightly OT but in the tracklisting for the score of the movie, one of the pieces was called 'Henry Plainview' - is that H.W.'s name? ChanB, don't know if you made a mistake in calling Daniel H.W. but I found it interesting.

I don't know about Eli killing Daniel. To be honest the beating and the murder was a shock because I didn't expect it at all - it was rather "wait, WTF?" for me - I didn't expect anything explicitly but certainly not for Daniel to start chucking bowling balls and clubbing Eli to death. But once I got over the shock it made sense, and certainly makes more sense than the reverse. These two have been locked in hatred for years now and it's always Daniel coming on top, so it's not surprising that he should come on top this time around too. What would Eli killing Daniel prove that would make the movie better in your opinion, Chris?

I'd like to think that Daniel hated Eli with all his heart at that point and thus killed him. Personally I think it's because they have hated each other for so long, you kind of build up this mythical image of the one you hate, one that's larger than life (or so I'd imagine, fortunately I haven't got personal experience) and to see that image be destroyed, for your enemy to be merely human - as Eli was seen as broken and desperate - it fills you up with rage and disappointment.

I'm not sure. Because otherwise he would have no reason to kill Eli; certainly it would have made more sense for Eli to stay alive if all Daniel wanted to do was to taunt him over milkshake. (Hee, I just wanted to use that). Then again... killing someone, isn't it the ultimate triumph? Eh. Now I'm just confusing myself.
 
Hee, cool! :D We're reversed. I did take Intro Psych but then I took other courses. :nod:

Oh, if it's not too much trouble, sure! :)

Haha. I hate when that happens. I love well balanced audio for movie theaters even if the "bigger" scenes aren't as loud as they usually are.
 
Oh, I see. That's fun. Oddly enough, I majored in psych and did take the intro module for political science, so we're kind of opposite... sort of. Your psych module wasn't the introductory one, right?

Do you want it? I could send it to you. It's very good (but you probably figured that one out by now). Heh.

Ah. I saw it in the theatre but it was OK. The score was loud at bits but I could hear the dialogue - I didn't have a problem with that. Yeah I know what you mean though, sometimes I skip movies in theatres because I know it's going to be difficult to hear the dialogue. I suffered watching The Constant Gardener - couldn't hear a thing and as a result I didn't like it. Ever since that I rented stuff I knew I'd need subtitles for (eg Ocean's Thirteen) :lol:
 
I majored in Political Science. :) Took a few classes on everything else I could. Hehe.

I must sit down with my iPod and the score for this movie. :nod: It's that good. Totally agree. It's great that the movie had long periods of not talking, but the score was enough.

Not at all. But I did watch it on DVD. It's not as loud as in the theater so everything balances out. I often have a hard time understanding dialogue in the theater because the bass is out of control and drowns it out.
 
Could be. I didn't get the killing of Eli, though. I was thinking about H.W's state of mind, if that may have had something to do with his actions at the time, but I'm not really sure.
 
Oh, no wonder. What are you/did you major(ing) in?

I know! Well I went to watch TWBB for the score (rabid Radiohead and Jonny fan :blush:) and it was amazing. The score on its own is good but together with the movie, it's just incredible. 'Convergence' and 'There Will Be Blood', as the derrick burns was just completely iconic. It's not something you forget. And I love the opening note (I believe it was 'Henry Plainview'), it just speaks so much about what the movie is about/its tone. And I really like 'Prospectors Arrive' just as a piece of music, it's so good. Some people have complained about how it was loud in some areas, and that they couldn't hear the dialogue, was that a problem for you? It wasn't, for me.
 
Ahhh, good question! Let me think....

Looking back, I saw him caring for him in a way that he didn't need to in order to keep his cover and gain sympathy via the kid. There were moments when I think he did love HW, maybe not a pure form of love, but I think he appreciated having someone to celebrate with, someone that looked up to him and that indeed was a prop for his show. It was when HW was hurt that he lost patience and couldn't keep using him without losing his temper. He lost that "love" because the kid wasn't as useful and because he had lost the relationship that grounded him in a way.

Don't know if I made sense. :lol: It's a complicated subject. Hehe.
 
I think that H.W. was jealous that his "Uncle" showed up and that jealousy led to him setting the fire.

As for why Plainview killed Eli... Other than being completely crazy I'm not really sure :lol: I honestly thought it would have been a better ending if the opposite happened: If Eli killed Plainview. Anyone have an opinion on that?
 
I just saw it this weekend. Loved the first half of the movie, but the second half had me going WTF?! I'll have to watch it again soon.

Sasha
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