Tell me about the protein the surgeons add to fusions

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marshrose

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Wow Jenny that's absolutely amazing to say the least!

Jan- I surely get what you mean on the pains, I have not tried a heating pad, only ice sofar, glad that each day is getting better and away from the sofa- I can relate- I hate my bed and bedroom now I've been in here so long on my back, I try to get up when I can and get around the house but, not much I can do at all, and only so long I can stand before things really get stirred up. It is great to hear you're doing so well!
 
I am curious to learn about this protien that is added to assist with fusing, has anyone had it (or everyone I assume) do you really fuse within 3-6 months instead of 12, and so on.

Has anyone read up or had experience with/about this protein? I tried reading up on it on google but I don't know enough to even know what I'm searching for, just that my surgeon used the tip of my vertabrae and added protien, that's all I know.

Any input is appreciated thanks!
 
Hey Rose,
Hope this finRAB you well and recovering more each day.

In your search on Google, try "bone morphogenic protein" (BMP). That is what the substance is called and I found a lot of info on it. It is relatively newly approved by FDA (less than ten years I know) but there is a lot of info on the internet if you search using that term.

I had a bone onlay fusion without hardware to correct spondylolithesis and the neurosurgeon used this material. He mixed it with cadaver bone to avoid using my iliac crest as he feels that is too painful. Anyway, that is his technique as I'm sure all surgeons have their own way of doing things. I have read that this material has revolutionized many of the procedures done by both neurosurgeons and orthopedist. I know that I was concerned post-op with moving around too much and the PA assured me that the surgeon had packed "that stuff" in there so well that I could move conservatively without risking doing damage to the fusion.

Hope this helps you on your info search.
Jan.
 
I had that stuff. doc used only BMP (bone morphogenic protein, as JanKR mentioned) and cages on my double fusion. no screws, roRAB or plates and no bone or bone fragments were used at all.

fused great but it sure wasnt 3-4 months it was around 9 months for one level and 12 months on the other. that was for full, complete fusion though, fusion actually started about 2 months in but took the full 12 for both levels to get to end stage.

I have my docs operation report.. in my operation the discs were removed, a gauze (that is later absorbed by the body) was soaked in liquid BMP and stuffed in the cages, which are hollow and have holes for bone to grow through. then the cages were placed between the vertebrae and more BMP was kinda dabbed around the area in front on the vertebrae and cages. get sewn back up and *presto* here I am several years later a very happy camper. my fusion is picture perfect and solid. bone grew around and through the cages (4 of em) and in front of the vertebrae a bit, and no bone growth happened behind the cages, which is the desired result (dont want new bone to grow towarRAB the spinal column). Ive had no real issues since. cured 90% of my pre fusion pain :)

as for the long time till end fusion I was a smoker and 46 at the time. stopped smoking after the operation though.

BMP is The Stuff.
 
Wow Jan no hardware lucky you! That's great, I didn't get that offered to me so now I am partially bionic- as my family calls it.

I am slowing doing better, it is true the first 2 weeks are the hardest, but much less than I anticipated for, I mean, I have the shower chair now, my toilet riser and a cane lol, but I can get away for a trip to the livingroom or kitchen without the cane now which is good given the status of my leg before the surgery(s).

You were right, I used you and onyx to keep in mind all the time when I was worried or really sore, I know you said about 3 weeks you started feeling human again, (I am fairly sure it was you?!) and this recovery, even though it's recovery, is technically easier and better than when I reherniated largely and did not know it, there were days upon days in my recovery THEN that I cried and just lost it saying I give up, I can't take anymore, nonstop horrible pains, my SO would just hold me and didn't know what to do.

It's not like that this time, thank God, I am having a normal recovery. Yay! I go this week to the surgeon for my 2 week check up and see how I do.

Thanks on the BMP, I am going to google it and read read read, that's all I can do, luckily I have a laptop or I'd really be going stir crazy, I hate too much TV it bores me at this point, a total of 7 going on 8 months on my back entirely.

Hope you're doing very well and healing and fusing nicely, how are things going?? Tell me more good news! lol
 
I had a 6 vertebrae fusion 2 years ago(cervical C3 to T1) and my doc used the protein as well along with the new Vertex System that allows the placement of screws prior to to adding the roRAB instead of the other way around. I fell 3 weeks post op...fell backwarRAB in the kitchen and rolled into the fridge with the back of my head. Not a single problem. My x-rays at 5 weeks showed I was already pretty well fused.

Good stuff!

Jenny
 
Hi Zeroman,
That's a great encouraging success story! Thanks for posting. It also cautions me to not get too crazy at only 4 1/2 months out although it feels like it is fusing well. Best to be careful for the long term and not get too rowdy. Did you do PT after your surgery? And how long did you have pain post-op? I'm still having some tweaks and soreness but thankfully have full strength in my legs (which was diminished prior to surgery). My neurosurgeon left my actual discs in and just cleaned up the extruded material (from what I understand from the OP report). Also did a lot of foraminotomy work as according to him everything in that area was very "tight". He fused L4-L5 due to spondylolithesis at that area.

Glad to hear you are doing so well. Love those success stories!
Jan.
 
Good to hear that you are OK Jenny after a scarey fall like that. Plus good to hear that your fusion was sturdy!!

Rose, I probably started feeling like the fusion was working around 2 months as both prior to surgery and immediately after I was feeling a sensation of the vertebrae kind of moving on each other. Particularly when rising out of a chair or turning in the bed. I don't feel that anymore and haven't for a while. I'm not sure if it is a good thing that I don't have the hardware as I have read that these type of fusions (the bone onlay without hardware) don't always work but I can't go there! I have to think that this is going to be my fix. I had told the surgeon to do whatever he felt best to stabilize on the first go around as I didn't want to do this again. Of course I understand there are no guarantees but he has a good track record (the reason I chose him).

Good to hear that you are doing better. Just hang in there. I am currently looking around for going back to work in something different than what I did before. My previous line of work was pretty physical and contributed to my back and neck issues. Driving without any problems although getting in and out of the car is still slow. I went out in the yard yesterday and tried to do some limited dead heading and checking on the plants. Our front yard is on a slope and I quickly found that is a no-no for an extended period of time. Ended up back on the sofa with the heat pad. There are certain things that aggravate the muscles and nerves still. But everyday is better as far as mobility and time away from the sofa......hope this is encouraging for you.
Jan.
 
Hi Jan

yup did PT about.. hmm hard to remeraber back.. I think maybe 6 months after surgery? did the water PT in a pool for 3 months I think, twice a week.

it sucked rather big time for like 3 weeks, then it just plain sucked for about weeks 3-8. started to feel like I wasnt the walking (lying?) dead after that. major pain was down around 3 months, then it was just aches and such for about another 3 months. I started to wean off the pain killers around 6 months, that was a 3 month taper. occasional Tylenol for a couple months after that and that was it.

I did have ups and downs pain wise for about 6-7 months. occasional flair ups that would worry me type of things. but they passed. its easy to get all sorts of excited when youre feeling better and forget youre not supposed to twist and bend and then *whoops* you do something stupid and regret it for days.

I dont even take Tylenol now unless I do something stupid, which Ive learned not to do (well mostly). maybe a couple Tylenol every month or so.

people fuse at different rates so only xrays will tell but about 5 months out I was feeling pretty good even though the fusion wasnt anywhere near done. I had to rein myself in as I wanted to get back to living after being cooped up and mainly on bed rest for months on end. so please be careful. dem bones are still chugging away doing their thing.

just take it easy till the doc says youre 100%, and even then pay attention to any restrictions (s)he might give. you dont want to go through this again :)
 
Hey Zeroman,
Thanks for the info. I was starting to feel like maybe I should be moving faster on the wean as I still find at 4 1/2 months that I need something at night or late evening (some nights more than others depending on how much I've done during the day). I've done a couple of major stupid moves (forgot and tried to pull my 85 lb lab up when she was sliding off the edge of the bed.....duh....and then my wallet slid off the paper dispenser at the bookstore and ended up in, thankfully!, a clean toilet. But, my impulse was to dive for it, of course. Paid for both of these episodes for a few days).

It was funny the last time that I saw the neurosurgeon, he said that he would prefer that I only take the vicodin every other day as it was like having a cocktail every night. I wanted to say "and your point is?" But, I didn't....I wanted to tell him I would like to just have discomfort every other night or every other month actually! Fortunately he has turfed me back over to my primary who has a little more generous understanding of pain management.

Thanks again for sharing and have a good week.
Jan.
 
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