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Well,Avatar mentions death and Chowder implies homosexuality.
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- Thread starter freeze_sr
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besskelly123
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24 here:
Some good points. And I respect your point of view just like I respect anyone here with a sensible and/or well reasoned point of view here.
In terms of what kind of animation I enjoy personally, I've always enjoyed sophisticated, intelligently planned, and mature animation personally (it's the kind I plan on making one day), but even with that being so I have great respect for old Disney films (The Lion King, The Nightmare Before Christmas, Tarzan, Hercules) and 90s saturday morning American animation (Kids WB, Fox Kids, Disney Afternoon, etc.). Those to me represent the pinnacle of children's animation, in terms of technical execution. They're visuals are good, the timing is right, and they don't pander to the young demographic, but instead do what any decent children's programming or cinema would do and appeal to everyone, not just kids, even if they get labeled "children's animation" even though they clearly appeal to all ages.
If one is going to make children's animation of the aformentioned variety, that has universal appeal and appeals to kids, and young or old adults of all ages, then more power to them.
However, on a personal note, my current personal preference, now that I'm older, lies with adult and mature themed animation on television or on DVD, either from Japan, or Europe or America, or all three. (i.e. Ghost in the Shell, Aqua Teen Hunger Force, Boondocks, Samurai Champloo, Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist). This is to say nothing of all of the "children's shows" or as I like to call them "all ages" shows like Avatar and Naruto and DBZ, etc., that appeal to people of all ages, which seem to appeal to an entirely new demographic altogether: the 8 - 24 demographic, give or take a few years.
In terms of mature or "adult" animation programming, I've always said about anime (ever since I found out about it around 1997 or so, somewhere around there, and doing a bit of reading up on the Japanese market) that I believe Japan sets a good animation industry example with anime, and always has for a while now, that animation in Japan is not simply thought of as a "children's medium" and hasn't been for a long time now. The proof of this fact lies in the way Japanese animation narrative is told: With the mature, intelligent view in mind. Clearly Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex is not intended by its makers for the same demographic shows like Johnny Test or Spongebob are.
In terms of content and demographics, those two kinds of shows are polar opposites. One appeals to mature and sophisticated and serious spirits, i.e. drama. And the other kind, ones of carefree and whimsy, i.e. comedy. It may sound strange in written form, but it's true. Those two genres have been around for much of history. But it's only been recently that the animation medium has gotten complex and technically superior enough for the two two genres to emerge in the medium of animation in any real noticeable way. Call it what you will: "Action", "Drama", "Suspense", it's all the same thing. But the former style wasn't anywhere near as visible in the 1940s as it is now. That's for certain.
Some good points. And I respect your point of view just like I respect anyone here with a sensible and/or well reasoned point of view here.
In terms of what kind of animation I enjoy personally, I've always enjoyed sophisticated, intelligently planned, and mature animation personally (it's the kind I plan on making one day), but even with that being so I have great respect for old Disney films (The Lion King, The Nightmare Before Christmas, Tarzan, Hercules) and 90s saturday morning American animation (Kids WB, Fox Kids, Disney Afternoon, etc.). Those to me represent the pinnacle of children's animation, in terms of technical execution. They're visuals are good, the timing is right, and they don't pander to the young demographic, but instead do what any decent children's programming or cinema would do and appeal to everyone, not just kids, even if they get labeled "children's animation" even though they clearly appeal to all ages.
If one is going to make children's animation of the aformentioned variety, that has universal appeal and appeals to kids, and young or old adults of all ages, then more power to them.
However, on a personal note, my current personal preference, now that I'm older, lies with adult and mature themed animation on television or on DVD, either from Japan, or Europe or America, or all three. (i.e. Ghost in the Shell, Aqua Teen Hunger Force, Boondocks, Samurai Champloo, Cowboy Bebop, Fullmetal Alchemist). This is to say nothing of all of the "children's shows" or as I like to call them "all ages" shows like Avatar and Naruto and DBZ, etc., that appeal to people of all ages, which seem to appeal to an entirely new demographic altogether: the 8 - 24 demographic, give or take a few years.
In terms of mature or "adult" animation programming, I've always said about anime (ever since I found out about it around 1997 or so, somewhere around there, and doing a bit of reading up on the Japanese market) that I believe Japan sets a good animation industry example with anime, and always has for a while now, that animation in Japan is not simply thought of as a "children's medium" and hasn't been for a long time now. The proof of this fact lies in the way Japanese animation narrative is told: With the mature, intelligent view in mind. Clearly Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex is not intended by its makers for the same demographic shows like Johnny Test or Spongebob are.
In terms of content and demographics, those two kinds of shows are polar opposites. One appeals to mature and sophisticated and serious spirits, i.e. drama. And the other kind, ones of carefree and whimsy, i.e. comedy. It may sound strange in written form, but it's true. Those two genres have been around for much of history. But it's only been recently that the animation medium has gotten complex and technically superior enough for the two two genres to emerge in the medium of animation in any real noticeable way. Call it what you will: "Action", "Drama", "Suspense", it's all the same thing. But the former style wasn't anywhere near as visible in the 1940s as it is now. That's for certain.
I don't think brief references to death (Looney Toons even did this) or homosexuality are going to corrupt/destroy any children's lives.
I really don't get exactly what you were implying with this quote, so do tell if you meant something else, I don't want to be putting words in your mouth.
I really don't get exactly what you were implying with this quote, so do tell if you meant something else, I don't want to be putting words in your mouth.
I'm kind of confused with the question because of the word "wrong". I don't think anyone is really wrong for watching any show on TV, it's their own choice. That being said, I don't watch children's cartoons because I find most of them boring. I don't think there is anything wrong with you, but why do you purposely watch shows that are aimed for a young demographic? When most people grow up, they find it harder to relate to shows that are for kids to watch. There are some exceptions, shows that can put in humor for adults like in Pixar movies or even Spongebob to an extent can get away with it a bit more.
MissMiller
New member
Because I believe that the purported differences between “kid shows” and “adult shows” have been greatly exaggerated. Stories have been told for millennia, and when all is said and done, television is nothing more than story telling. If you like the story that is being told, as well as the characters that are being used to tell that story, shouldn’t you watch it? I understand that the content varies between “kid shows” and “adult shows”, primarily due to what the network deems appropriate, but a good story doesn’t need sex and violence to be entertaining. As I’ve said earlier in this thread, I fervently believe that the humor in “Foster’s Home For Imaginary Friends” is more refined than the humor I find on “Family Guy” or “Drawn Together”.
I still watch shows that are aimed at my demographic. “Heroes”, for example. However, I love animation more, and even though most animated programs are designed for children, I believe that people can find genuinely entertaining experience watching them.
I still watch shows that are aimed at my demographic. “Heroes”, for example. However, I love animation more, and even though most animated programs are designed for children, I believe that people can find genuinely entertaining experience watching them.
miss_natsi
New member
I think we need to tread carefully when we start equating "maturity, sophistication and seriousness" with "action". I'd say that The Simpsons has more social relevance than, say, Batman: TAS, for a start. If anything, the most thematically sophisticated cartoons are the ones which can't be classed as action or comedy.
Miranda <3
New member
Well said. And I'd say this goes for every medium.
I, myself, don't go "seeking out" children's fare for the sake of finding children's fare like you're implying, Toonback. In fact, I doubt that's true of most of us here. But, speaking for myself at least, The Huntsman pretty much hit the nail on the head when he said the type of humor in shows like "Foster's Home" is much more refined than in "Drawn Together". I like a good sex joke as much as the next guy, but ultimately, anybody can fill a show with sex jokes and potty humor with relatively little thought, and get a laugh out of people. Again, not that I don't find said jokes funny, but there's a huge gap of class and quality that the writing in shows like Foster's Home and Chowder provide. Even when a kid-oriented cartoon uses potty humor or sex jokes, its done so more subtly and more intelligently, which speaks volumes more to the talent of the writers, and comes off as far more witty than in shows like Drawn Together where the joke is shoved out more blatantly.
I also think there's something very much to be said when a writer can make content that appeals to both adults and children for the same reason. Shrek is a great series of movies, but ultimately you get kids laughing at jokes completely unrelated to the jokes adults laugh at. Adults notice a Starbucks sign in the background and crack up, kids see some slapstick punch and crack up. Nothing wrong with that, but again, anybody can do that and make something appealing to all audiences.
What takes true talent, IMO, is when you get a series of books like Harry Potter or a TV series like Foster's Home where kids and adults generally appreciate the exact same thing. If there's a well-timed and well-animated slapstick joke, both kids AND adults will laugh at it the same. If there's some funny situation or dialogue, again, in most cases both adults and kids will laugh at the same thing at the same time. That takes some real talent being able to write something that is universally funny regardless of age, and in general, a good kid's cartoon like Foster's Home or Chowder can do that.
It's that classy style of writing that draws me to comedies meant for kids, and it's the universal sense of adventure and character relations you see in kid's cartoons like One Piece or The Spectacular Spider-Man or the Harry Potter books that draws me to more action oriented stuff meant for kids. It's not so much that I look for it just because it's meant for kids so much as because, over the course of my life, I find more things of interest in kid venues than I do adult venues. That's not to say there isn't plenty of adult oriented stuff I love (Lost, 24, Family Guy, Cowboy Bebop) it's just that I find stuff I like there less often than I do with kid's stuff.
I, myself, don't go "seeking out" children's fare for the sake of finding children's fare like you're implying, Toonback. In fact, I doubt that's true of most of us here. But, speaking for myself at least, The Huntsman pretty much hit the nail on the head when he said the type of humor in shows like "Foster's Home" is much more refined than in "Drawn Together". I like a good sex joke as much as the next guy, but ultimately, anybody can fill a show with sex jokes and potty humor with relatively little thought, and get a laugh out of people. Again, not that I don't find said jokes funny, but there's a huge gap of class and quality that the writing in shows like Foster's Home and Chowder provide. Even when a kid-oriented cartoon uses potty humor or sex jokes, its done so more subtly and more intelligently, which speaks volumes more to the talent of the writers, and comes off as far more witty than in shows like Drawn Together where the joke is shoved out more blatantly.
I also think there's something very much to be said when a writer can make content that appeals to both adults and children for the same reason. Shrek is a great series of movies, but ultimately you get kids laughing at jokes completely unrelated to the jokes adults laugh at. Adults notice a Starbucks sign in the background and crack up, kids see some slapstick punch and crack up. Nothing wrong with that, but again, anybody can do that and make something appealing to all audiences.
What takes true talent, IMO, is when you get a series of books like Harry Potter or a TV series like Foster's Home where kids and adults generally appreciate the exact same thing. If there's a well-timed and well-animated slapstick joke, both kids AND adults will laugh at it the same. If there's some funny situation or dialogue, again, in most cases both adults and kids will laugh at the same thing at the same time. That takes some real talent being able to write something that is universally funny regardless of age, and in general, a good kid's cartoon like Foster's Home or Chowder can do that.
It's that classy style of writing that draws me to comedies meant for kids, and it's the universal sense of adventure and character relations you see in kid's cartoons like One Piece or The Spectacular Spider-Man or the Harry Potter books that draws me to more action oriented stuff meant for kids. It's not so much that I look for it just because it's meant for kids so much as because, over the course of my life, I find more things of interest in kid venues than I do adult venues. That's not to say there isn't plenty of adult oriented stuff I love (Lost, 24, Family Guy, Cowboy Bebop) it's just that I find stuff I like there less often than I do with kid's stuff.