Superman Returns

It's been obvious for a little while now that there is not going to be a happy ending here... just like the movie itself, in a way. It's currently projected to end on around $180-185 million.

He will return, but it's obvious there will have to be changes.

Don't forget the writers, they shoulder a huge chunk of the responsibility. It wasn't Singer who forgot to write a plan for Luthor or didn't give him enough dialog. To what extent he signed off on it is hard to say, but he isn't solely to blame.

One issue that has not yet been addressed is that Superman might just not be very popular. Over the last 5 years or more, his 4 monthly comic books have regularly found themselves outside the top 50 of best selling comics, sometimes outside the top 100 even. Not just once in a while, regularly. His 90s animated show was never as popular as WB wanted it to be, and fan reaction to his appearance on the animated Justice League show has been very negative too, calling him "a wuzz", "weakling", and many other unflattering names. The live-action Lois & Clark show was also a bit of a ratings disaster and went trough countless tweaks and changes before being canned. Only Smallville has been succesful, and that's not really Superman.

Xmen 1 and 2 were much more reality based, far less stylized, and nowhere near as grand in scope. Xmen 1 took in around $150 million at the box office, but had only a third of Superman's budget. Xmen 2 did better with just over $210 million, and half the budget of Superman. X3 was not a Singer movie, but has sofar been one of the biggest movies this year with $230 million so far, and a budget close to Superman's.

All in all, Superman's box office is bad, but it's not so bad that WB will drop all plans for a sequel, assuming they feel Singer, or whomever does the next one, can deliver what they feel is the right kind of movie. Keep in mind, SR has still gotten great reviews from most of the credible sources. Roger Ebert was one of the few big name reviewers who panned it, but his reviews do carry a lot of weight with the American movie-goers.
 
I thought he was great and certain aspects of his role are clearly a tribute to Christopher Reeve. I may be wrong (as I am a lesbian) but is he not also gorgeous...?



I didn't like Bosworth's casting before seeing the film. Having seen it I feel she is not as bad as I expected, but there were other actresses I would like to see in this role. I have just checked out Bosworth on IMDb and am astonished to find she is 23 years old - she looks slightly older than that but you are right, she is clearly too young for this role. Brandon Routh is nearly 27 and I think actually they could have cast someone a bit older than him in the Lois Lane role and it would have done no harm at all. Apparently they were looking at Claire Danes which I would have liked to have seen - a better actress than Bosworth and I get the feeling she would have put a bit more spunk in the role and a bit less damsel in distress... Also I always thought of Lois as being a bit older and wiser than Clark!!



The film is a 12A, I was surprised it was not a PG before watching but now having seen it I think it has the right rating and younger kiRAB shouldn't be there; I am sure it would scare me if I was a young'un. Scenes such as

Superman getting stabbed with the sliver of kryptonite by Lex

are not really suitable for kiRAB.
 
I agree!! Nowadays morals are not what they were so I think its America changing around Superman not vice versa
seem as how they like to justify wars and elect complete morons to run the country

The American flag? I understand that he is Americas hero and all that jazz but isnt he in our times a superhero for people the world over?

The gay thing really pissed off a lot of people in production/cast. I was watching an interview on "Good Day LA"with Brandon Routh and it was 2 girls and a guy presenting/interviewing. At the end of the interview this bimbo started ranting about how the gay community will make the movie succeed and how does he (Brandon) feel about Gay attention to which he completely ignored her and answered the guys question of when it was out to which the satelite feed of Brandon was then promptly cut.

Also Im sure that whole is it true that they had to photo shop the size of your package?didnt help. I agree with him when he says that they have better things to spend their money on.
 
Yes, there was a certain unintentional irony to Luthor invoking the now classic "Bring it on" line, and then turning out to be a clueless fool who has little or no plan whatsoever... and who also happens to be the President of the US in the comics :)

Yes, the moronic nature of American flag-worshipping is an infinite source of embarrassment to those who engage in such practices.

Heh, didn't see that. Wouldn't have happened to have been a Fox affiliate, would it? Have you got a link?

The size of Superman's "equipment" was apparently also the subject of much debate, as well as a rigorous screening process to find just the right cod piece during production of the original Superman The Movie. I thgink one of the documentaries has a whole segment on it :)
 
Yes, Singer's eagerness to stake his claim to the sequel by going to Comic Con and doing tons on interviews, some more confused than others, almost felt a little bit like he knew he wasn't a lock for the sequel and wanted to put WB in a position of having to fire him, if they decided to go in a different direction. I might be reading too much into it, but it seemed like he played all his carRAB in a very deliberate way.

Anyway, I doubt we will hear anything concrete until the DVD sales are in, unless WB are desperate to get the sequel out for Superman's 70th anniversary in 2008, in which case they will need to get the ball rolling very soon. They certainly can't afford to wait as long as they did with the recently announced Batman sequel.
 
And in smallville, Clark is unsure whether or not he can have sex, said he doesn't want to risk with lana incase he blows her head off, lol.

I didn't follow the comics so not sure what the true storyline is, whether or not he can.

But the film SR is set 5 years after superman 2, in superman 2 there is a scene were Clark gives up his powers for Lois & shortly after a scene is shown with Lois & Clark together in bed linen sharing a moment or 2 in the fortress of solitude.

Now as people have said already, one can assume it is when he gave up his powers that the child was conceived and the powers were still there as a delay.

Then again it could be from some other time, which it may be mentioned in the sequel.
 
Wow,thanks for that,you pretty much started where they cut it off last night.
Have to say im glad he didnt get the girl lol,Richard is a nice guy and he deserves to hang on to her.Again thanks for such a detailed description of the ending. :)
 
I'm not sure with that. I would say IMAX wherever they are.

Yep, he does appear to have powers. In one scene were Lex has locked Lois & the child up, the child is playing the Piano and then all of a sudden it whizzes past and the kid is left holding his inhaler.

Maybe the inhaler stopped him before from using the powers or when he had been in contact with the kryptonite it did something.

I'll leave it there, don't want to say anything else
 
The think is though with the Batman Begins sequel The Dark Knight there was never any doubt that there was going to be sequel as Batman Begins was very sucessful in the cinema and on DVD!
Unlike Superman Returns which did badly in the cinema and the studio are hoping that it makes some money on DVD just so the film can break even!
 
It's not technically a lie of somebody profited off the movie. WB certainly aren't in that group yet, though. As a rule of thumb, a movie has to make at least twice its budget to be even close to profitable for the studio.

Even the sycophantic interviewer clearly didn't think it was profitable yet, and rightfully so, and when Singer lobs that rather odd response at him, he just swallows it hook, line, and sinker. Not even a follow-up question to qualify the remark.

The internet is a rich source of misinformation. Things like this need to be nipped quickly.

There is one other possible explanation, though. WB and Singer might have hyped the budget. A lot of people have commented that it doesn't look like a $200 million movie, much less $260 million. Could it be that the movie was closer to the $150 million mark? If so, if we discount the money spent on non-starters over the last 10 years, SR's $340 million worldwide box office would mean it has broken even. It's not that unlikely an explanation, but it's probably not one WB would like to confirm, even if it were true.
 
Im just so very dissapointed that I honestly do feel like I wanna get sick.

It wasnt too bad last night when I had researched the gross of SR but I had the time to dig a lil deeper this time and found all that kinda stuff

I agree with you on the writers and as you said on an earlier post that it was stupid to pick a random amount of the mythology push it together and get the audience to buy into it without any real explanations. It just shows that they could have filled up some of the screen time with some explanations not an essay or anthing of the sort but even at least Superman trying to find out about Jasons life (which xould have covered conception which seems to be A burning issue)

I know Bosworth didnt do a too bad job but I think we have to go all Anne Robinson for the next film(if there is one) and ditch the dead wood. Not that Bosworth is dead wood but she doesnt exactly shine in SR and I think that if we do get a new movie then we have to treat it as the last ditch attempt so Boswroth doesnt have time to grow and fill out the role we need Lois in an instant not a trilogy of movies!. I defiantely think that a new team of writers is DESPERATELY NEEDED and as a previous poster suggested maybe even a consultant at DC that couldnt do any harm.

It really puzzles me as to why Superman isnt popular. I have always found him to be the best hero but maybe its due to the lack of big enemies in the publics knowledge. It didnt really do anything new just the tried and tested "Lex, Kryptonite and badly laid out plan involving land/power" routine Audiences are becomming a lot more choosey when it comes to a Superhero Movie with this maybe working against it.

Maybe there is a cause of over saturation with the Superman franchise? Smallville is hardly Americas fave TV show and its been on for five years. Before that the ever so successful (not!) Lois and Clark made Superman into a bit of a joke TBH then before that Superboy(which Ive never seen so I cant comment(. This isnt Spiderman, XMEN or Batman they have all had breaks from the public in general for may years so there has been a thirst for what the public hasnt had and its hard to market a character that PROTENTIALLY people are tired of so if I were the cw Id be making Smallvilles upcomming season its last to give the public a break and then come out guns blazing. Not to mention that Smallville has ssullied the name of Superman for many with its teen target audience.

I wish I coud speed up time and see what happens years down the line but failing that Ill have to be like everybody else and play it day by day!
 
Im sorry but I stopped thinking about what the article was trying to say as soon as I read

"Superman has legs like Christopher Reeve, and that could mean a poor showing at the video store."

Im not a Reeve fan but this to me is extremely risqu
 
Yeah Id at least like to own some of that rubbish or even have the chance to!! TBH snd Im glad about the relaese date maybe even in time for my birthday!!!!!!

Yes that indeed was Maxima Im surprised that the whole thing of Krytonian mating rules are so flimsy and it seemed kinda plausible but maybe I could come to grow to like this storyline as long as he isnt prepped to be the next new even More Super Superman!

Well the WB machine has worked as I have made my appointment for another helping of Superman Returns (Im determined to make this movie work even if it costs me millions!!!!!!)
 
HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM........................................

Im starting to be convinced that the sequel aint gonna be as straight forward as first thought(yes I have 95% accepted that there will be a sequel as well as 95% accepted that it wont break even in the US)

From the interview it sounRAB like Richard is here to stay, hes talking about Superman taking on a Jor El role which will be more distanced parenting rather han being there for his son in the sense of living with him etc.

Im still partly resenting Singer as he wont give us what we want! He is a "fan" of the Superman franchise but as such REFUSES to give us the extrended edit. I understand that in cinemas he had to appeal to the mainstream and get bums on seats but when you buy an extended cut you know EXACTLY what you are buying, you are a fan and want more than the original edit you wanna see it all, it may nit be good but it still doesnt make you think "Superman Returns is crap" because you liked it enough to begin with to even buy the damn thing!

Seriously Tenacious G that really sounRAB a LOT closer! I dont think that they will be pushing for a Summer release again they willl have to evaluate the sharks in the water first! I would so love a Superman Movie for 2008 that seems a LOT closer than 2009!

Oh and thats a really good description of the last few mins! I really love the delivery of

"You will be Different. Sometimes you will feel like an outcast, but you'll never be alone. You will make my strength your own. You will see my life through your eyes, as your life will be seen through mine. The son becomes the father. The father becomes the son"

Seriously its becomming one of my all time fave scenes I love its sincerity and the fact that we the audience as well as Superman begin to realise the complications that arise of his son and how in some form or another he has to father this child without stepping on RicharRAB toes

And I think Singer has pretty much confirmed that there will be implications from the crystals going into space with New Krypton interesting................................

And I may be stoned for this but I really quite like how they did Nuclear Man in IV! Im half way through it (maybe more) and the story is just ok sure there are a lot of flaws but hey Superman Returns has a lot too! Maybe we will FINALLY get to see a villain that can match Superman and if Im sounding really hopeful Id love to see some inflight fight scenes they could be done great with todays technology!

So far Superman IV is a lot better than III but maybe Im biased because IV was released in 1987 the year I was born!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
I enjoyed it. In terms of superhero remakes, it was not as good as Spiderman or Batman Begins, but it was much better than The Hulk.

It was quite story-led rather than being all-out action and the ending was very open, so it felt more like a TV pilot than a cinema movie.

Kevin Spacey was excellent as Lex Luthor, just about the right blend of menace and lunacy. The rest of the cast were OK but certainly not outstanding. Still, it's a comic book film, not Shakespeare :-)
 
Spot on, in my opinion.

The trailer should have used the famous John Williams theme tune, it would have caught the imagination far more. It seemed have been aimed at teenyboppers, when many of us remember queuing for hours in 1978,( remember then there were not multi screens.)

Batman Begins, I wasn't expecting to enjoy it, but it was fantastic. I think expectation levels have damaged Supperman Returns, in a similar way to The Phantom Menace, whereas, expectation wasn't really there for Batman.
 
It's box office is nowhere near Superman's. It had a smaller opening, and is currently just matching it's day-by-day numbers. Superman seems to be winning that particular race.

Ironically, on one of the Superman Returns specials, Singer was shown as a joke heading over to the King Kong set and taking over direting duties for Jackson while he took a nap.

It has just gone in release outside the US, so the numbers will catch up. WB delayed the worldwide release due to the World Cup.

I've seen it 5 times. I was lucky enough to weasel my way into 2 press screenings, and after that I watched it 3 times in one day.

Most people seem to think so, and the box office reflects this view too. LIke I said before, on the expectation that it was a great Superman movie, I was still not expecting it to do massive business. This was based purely on my sense of the style and tone of the movie from the trailers. It turned out the movie was not as good as I had expected, and it looks like it will do even worse than my $250 million prediction.

Always refreshing to hear some positive response to the movie :)

I think the movie's intention was just right. I was extremely pleased when Singer started hinting it was a strong character movie. It still needed action, of course, and it had that, but much of the action didn't work well, and there were many other problems dragging the movie down in my view. I still very much like it, moreso with each viewing, but I can definitely see why it has failed to inspire most movie-goers.

It's not so much that it was another real estate scheme, but that fact that it was so poorly thought through. What was he going to do with a giant, inhabitable, black piece of kryptonite laced rock? Who's going to buy beach front property there? And where was his supposed alien technology he was planning to repel any would-be attackers with, when the rest the World decided it was time for a "regime change" at Costa Del Lex? The movie just had too many flaws like that.

And that's where they fell flat on their face. This is where the movie really failed to connect with most people, except more "dedicated" Superman fans :)

The marketing has been all over the place. If you didn't make an effort tracking down interviews on the web, going purely on the strength of the trailers and promos, you wouldn't really be sure what it was all about, and at least a couple of the many promos would seem to undermine what you thought it was all about. One trailer suggested it was an OC style teeny bopper movie, another that it was a love story, and we covered every subject from epic adventure through to smack-bang-summer-blockbuster-action. It was just a mess. This was WB's misguided attempt at targeting the movie at everyone, and in the process failing to find a core audience at all.

I agree. Superman is more interesting set against a real-world backdrop, but they found a nice balance with Darkseid in the 90s animated series, but he would best be left for a 3rd installment. We need to steady the ship first, and a smaller scale villain would better for the next one.

For some reason, in terms of villain, I think they will go bigger rather than smaller for the sequel.

Dark red. Deep, dark red... so very, very dark. :)

Exactly. It's far too heavy a movie for non-Superman fans.


Possibly. They did use the Williams theme, of course, but broke its momentum in all the trailers. Not sure if changing that would have sold the movie better, I dount it somehow. The epic music for the international trailer worked well, I thought. The whole tone of the movie was just too dark and retro, and while more focused advertising would have helped a little, I don't think it would have made that much of a difference.



The movie studios have to target a young demographics for their blockbusters. As a consumer group, the over-35s are just not that attractive to movie studios.

Phantom Menace was absolutely huge. It made more than twice what Batman Begins did, and had a much smaller budget.
 
OMG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I think your deluded!

There is a lot of action in SR where in S3 we get Superman and Lana and her kid for AGES!!!!!!!

Yeah you should probably get your head back up to the clouRAB!!!
 
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