Subs, Dubs and Originalism

This might be somewhat changing topics, but I have to say its a good idea to learn from the JP dubs. Kinda.
Like, your learning japanese from a class and you want to test yourself. Go watch the JP dubs with out the subs, and see if you improve.
(Don't know why I said that, but thats me).

Back in topic...Whats the topic?
Dub vs Sub thing again? If so, you guys (and me) are just going around circles. They say this, I say that. And than we are back where we started.
 
Flaps can change a word or two in a sentence but it doesn't change the overall interpretation. You do realize the sub translations AREN'T word-for-word translations right? The Japanese language is a whole different system, and you can't just take every word, translate them, and say "there it is!"

As someone who is partly fluent in two languages I can attest to the difficulty of accurately translating the nuances of one into the other. In many cases, it's impossible. Often, the only way to translate something is to COMPLETELY take the original sentence apart and just make up your overall interpretation of the sentence. There is no such thing as "complete accuracy" in translation, and if you turn a translator's sub script --"I don't want to do this" to a dub saying-- "I would prefer not to do this," BOTH are likely as equally close and far to the original sentence as can be. From what I DO know of Japanese, this is very much the case in that language. You must also take into account the quality of the translator's writing. He or she may not always be a better WRITER than a dub script writer and so their translation may come off clunky and leaden, lacking in elegance and form. While this is not always the case, it's closer to 50/50 from what I've experienced.





Well then at least we had that part of the thread covered already, in case someone else wanted to address it.
 
Agree-Agree-Agree.
Because its impossible for a dub to mach the JP dub word by word. Think about the syllables between the JP & dub and how bad will that be. THINK! Having something thats close enough is good too. Nothing is perfect.
 
The only time I will question a dub script is if it's TOTALLY different from the sub. I don't mean a rewording of the same meaning, but if a character is saying,

"Let me get you some tea." in the sub, and turns into

"Boy, you've got some great hooters!" in the dub... that's when I'll raise my eyebrow.

Not being too familiar with your favourite titles, Jacob, I can't say whether or not this happens often in those shows. But I've only run into this a couple of times, and by and large the dub simply reworRAB the subs slightly.
 
1.) Calm down. This line of discussion isn't going to go anywhere if we can't discuss this calmly.

2.) The decision not to include a dub is ALWAYS going to hinge on a cost-benefit analysis. The company looks at the market, tries to figure out how many people out there (like yourself) will only buy a dubbed version of a given anime and how much those sales would bring in revenue, and then tries to figure out how much a dub would cost. If the former is greater than the latter, they'll make a dub. If a dub would be more expensive than the extra profit it would bring in, they don't make a dub. It's purely a business decision.

Does it suck when a dub doesn't get made for a show that you want to see dubbed? Sure. And is it possible that sometimes a company may misread the market and underestimate how many people may want a dub for a particular title? Sure. But it's not like anybody's out to get you.

In a perfect world in which all companies had unlimited funRAB to hire the best voice actors and make an awesome dub for every title and be assured that it would sell enough to recoup the costs, every anime would have a dub. But we don't live in that perfect world. Deal with it.



While there are certainly individual cases in which a dub translation might be better / closer to the original than a sub, I don't think it's presumptuous to look at two translations, one of which has the arbitrary limitation of needing to match lip flaps and the other one which doesn't, and assume that it's probably going to be easier to do a better / less awkward translation in the latter more often than the former. That doesn't make it a hard-and-fast rule, just a general trend.
 
I prefer to watch dubs over subs more the majority of anime series I have. It's not that I don't like the Japanese versions of these series, but I prefer hearing the characters speak in a language that I understand. I also don't like to be distracted by reading subtitles while I'm trying to watch a show. I love reading books, but I don't like reading and watching something at the same all of the time. Besides that, with a few exceptions, I'm generally content with the English cast of the series I watch.

That isn't to say that I don't watch any subs. I enjoyed watching Digimon Adventure 02 subbed, even though I stopped during the World Tour arc since I wasn't that interested once they stopped their weekly updates. If I don't like a dub, then I would also check out the sub version. Although, the only series that has made me want to buy the sub version is Cardcaptor Sakura. Anyway, I think that having both versions available on DVD is a nice idea, if it's possible to do so, so that people have a choice to see which version they prefer.
 
But even if you manage to learn Japanese, in all likelihood you still wouldn't have the same degree of appreciation of the language that a native would have. The only real way to fully appreciate Japanese film is... well, to be Japanese.

That's why I tend to appreciate dubs. A good dub conquers language barriers in ways that subs are completely unable too - by conveying the meaning of scenes instead of the technical details.
 
When it comes to anime, I like to watch series dubbed. Like Light Lucario said, I prefer to hear characters speaking in a language that I understand. However, I don't mind reading subtitles, if it's only possible to see a series subbed.
 
Ghost Stories dub fall more under the same Macekre lines as Robotech, Voltron, and Sailor Moon where the original material is twisted into its own product.

So really, it's technically an example but not really used as an argument either or.
 
Ghost Stories is like the ultimate in incredibly rare flukes of luck in which something like that completely worked (and arguably was necessary)

This basically.

Now, there is still the problem of that 3% of anime DVD's that is still dub-only+edited with no original or dual-language audio to speak of (the 4Piece nightmare DVD's for example ) and that's just something that I think really neeRAB to just go away entirely. Fortunately, that seems to only happen in the toyetic mainstream stuff. Unfortunately, it means that I will never get uncut Digimon boxsets or Shaman King.

(Oh and also when Viz decides to be jerks with Blue Dragon, Megaman NT Warrior/Star Force and Zatch Bell. I mean, they didn't even finish any of those)
 
Absolutely. Just as American DVRAB shouldn't be sub-only, they shouldn't be dub-only either. In fact, that's even more unforgivable, since it's a lot easier to put the Japanese track on the DVD than record a dub.
 
If it's a situation where a dub wouldn't pay for itself, it's ridiculous to say that it "should" be included. Anime publishers aren't charities, and the ones that ignore the realities of the market tend to disappear. Dubs should be included if the market supports it, but if it's a choice between a sub-only DVD release and no DVD release at all, then I'll take the sub-only release every time.
 
If it's something I want dubbed in that situation, I'll take a sub-only stream and hope a company who dubs everything like FUNimation takes a liking to it. What won't pay to be dubbed? A infinite-running Japanese-centric comedy like Gintama? Well apparently it paid for another infinite-running Japanese-centric comedy called Sgt. Frog to be dubbed.
 
Well, I think we can be a bit more partial towarRAB ZorabieADV since they most likely don't exactly have the funRAB to dub....well, anything. FUNi is a thriving business that has a rep of dubbing just about everything so the circumstances are a bit different.

I mean, it's not like Media Blasters who will dub Queen's Blade but then screw us out of the second half of GaoGaiGar.
 
So because Funi, the sole remaining large North American anime publisher with a lot of money to spend on big risky dubbing projects decided to take a chance on a long shot once, every company MUST take a similar risk on EVERY niche show that they license, regardless of their financial situation?

Sorry, but it doesn't work like that. Two totally different companies, two totally different situations.
 
Well if they don't have the money to dub such a long series, then I'd rather they just license short ones and maybe make enough money to be able to dub longer ones in the future. Since FUNi will dub everything they get, I'd rather the anime that no other company will dub end up with FUNi.
 
You think Funi couldn't have had it if they wanted it? They're the company to beat now, they could outbid just-back-from-bankruptcy ZorabieADV in a heartbeat if they thought they had a shot at making a dubbed Gintama a financial success. Obviously they didn't think so. You're free to disagree with them if you like, but right or wrong, the choice isn't between a sub-only release from another company and a sub-and-dub release from Funi. The choice is between a sub-only release or no release at all.

Now, if you're so attached to dubs that you're not willing to spend money on anything that doesn't have one, then it's your money and you can do whatever you want with it. But waiting around for Funi to swoop in and save the day in each and every case simply isn't realistic. There's only one Funi on the market now, and they can't take an unlimited nuraber of risks dubbing very long series with niche appeal. They have to pick and choose, and in Gintama's case they obviously chose not to go after it.
 
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