Not All Cops Are Trigger-Happy Rednecks

Police work is hard, it's dangerous, and it's usually underpaid. I have a ton of respect for anyone who takes on the job and who does it to the best of his or her ability. Cops deal with lots of shit, and with lots of shitty people, and the way that some cops are able to maintain their equanimity and their professionalism in very difficult situations is always a marvel to me.

I saw a video a few years back where a cop in some midwestern state (Iowa? I can't remember) was involved in a car chase with what turned out to be a mentally unstable woman. The woman pulled into a driveway, jumped out of the car, and brought both hands up as if she were about to fire a gun. It was dark, and while you could see that there was something in her hands, it was not clear what the object was.

If i were the cop, right about then i probably would have put four or five shots into her torso. But the cop in the video hid behind his car, didn't fire his gun, and gave himself time to ascertain that the woman was holding a wallet. He jumped out and grabbed her and placed her under arrest without hurting her. It's always struck me as an incredible example of calm under pressure. People who can do this stuff deserve all our respect and more money than they currently earn.

And, even when they're not facing down crazy and potentially-armed suspects, many cops do an excellent job keeping the peace in their day-to-day work.

But...

As kingbighair notes, let's get out of fantasyland with that 99.9 percent number.

The problem with so many big-talking cop defenders like the OP is that they are so keen to stomp all over any criticism that they turn from defenders of good cops into apologists for bad ones. That's the only way to explain numbers like "99.9%."

A cop doesn't have to shoot someone in order to act like a bully and overstep his or her authority. And cops acting like bullies happens far more than simple-minded morons like the OP are willing to admit. Because if 99.9 percent of cops were, in fact, great cops, we'd hear virtually no stories about police intimidation or brutality or illegal activities.

While i firmly believe that truly bad cops are a minority, they are a much more significant and troubling minority than the OP and his ilk would have you believe, and in some departments they constitute a large enough group to poison the whole culture of the force. We should be working to weed out assholes like this, so that we are safer in our streets, and so that they don't tarnish the reputations of the cops who really are doing their job properly.
 
Big ups to the decent cops out there. They do a valuable job and should be commended.

But let's bring that 99.9% number down a bit.
Amen to the first, and probably also to the second, though I have absolutely no way of knowing what the percentage actually is. (ETA: Although from what I've heard, some police departments have a culture in which it's a lot harder for the rotten apples to exist than others.)

As I've said before, there are few professions more deserving of respect than good cops ("good" as in both competent and ethical), and few more deserving of contempt than bad cops.
 
I know if the pay of LEO's was any shittier, only psychopaths and idealists would want to join up, but what would be the benefits of paying them even more money?
 
If good cops were more willing to denounce and help get rid of the bad cops instead of protecting and covering for them i would be a lot more willing to give them any respect. The way i see it there is bad cops and those who enable them to continue being bad cops.
 
Every time some crazed bastard on the police force uses excessive force to make an arrest, and every time a police officer uses perfectly reasonable force to make an arrest but the arrestee has a better public relations guy, we get a thread where people talk about how much police officers suck. OK, so there are a-holes on the force. There are also a-holes in politics, law, medicine, the education system, and this message board. That doesn't mean that all cops are crazed maniacs who want to tazer little puppies and kittens while laughing madly and firing AKs into the air. And when somebody is waving a gun around a bunch of cops and yelling about killing them all, he deserves to get shot.

Overall, cops do us all a great service by making our lives safer. Of course, the thousands of arrests that go perfectly smoothly and put deadly criminals behind bars are never reported, but when a cop shoots a gundealer because he looked like he pulled out a gun, we're all morrally outraged.

Why can't we all recognize the great service 99.9% of cops do us, and realize that the other cops are the exception, not the norm?

Seriously... I bet if any of the "Cops are evil incarnations of Darth Vader elder evils" were being chaced by a knife-wielding maniac, they'd suddenly love to see a cop go a little trigger-happy.

(Message brought to you by the Fraternal Order of Police.)
 
If good cops were more willing to denounce and help get rid of the bad cops instead of protecting and covering for them i would be a lot more willing to give them any respect. The way i see it there is bad cops and those who enable them to continue being bad cops.

+1.
 
I know if the pay of LEO's was any shittier, only psychopaths and idealists would want to join up, but what would be the benefits of paying them even more money?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070822184906AAdD4QM
Detroit cops make 47,500 base and wind up at about 60,000 a year. I don't think that is shitty, especially when Detroit is so financially depressed.
 
It would be helpful if the OP could link to the post of the person who claimed that "All Cops Are Trigger-Happy Rednecks", because I can't find it.

It's not a direct quote. I was responding to the hate shown towards cops in general in every "Bad Cop Thread".

Face it, humans become really crass and base entities when they get a taste of unadulterated power
But cops don't have unadulterated power. They are subject to the law (At least in theory, although in some places that is not the case. But the bad cops are not the problem in those places, the whole society is).
U.S. police forces, in my opinion/experience, seem to be trained to harness that unadulterated power as a valid source of their "civil calming" mandate. It's hating the way the cop is used, not the person in the cop uniform.
Care to share your experience? I'm not saying you're lying or anything like that, I just want to hear why you think that so I can make my own judgement.

Yeah, we should all just lay off, and let the cops shoot anyone they want, whenever they want, without us raising so much as a peep.That'd encourage high levels of professional responsibility on the force, for sure.
So if the drug dealer looks like he's taking out a gun and is about to fire it, the officer should wait until he gets hit by the first bullet before firing back? I know someone gave an example of a cop who did wait and it turned out to not be a gun, but in that example, if the woman had a pistol, she could have shot and killed the cop, or an innocent bystander.

You're wasting your time babale with this topic on this board.
How so? I'm not trying to change someone else's opinions, I'm just putting mine out there through a min-rant that leads to a debate.

That doesn't mean every one who works with children is a pedophile, but there IS a higher chance of a daycare worker or scout leader being a pedophile than say electricians or lawyers.
But how many people do you know who call scout leaders in general evil or facist? Or the equivelent of Evil and Facist for a pedophile?

99.9? Lets start around 67.2
OK, 99.9 was an hyperbole that was meant to convey "the large majority". I did not mean for it to be taken literally. I appologise.

But is 67.2 not a hyperbole, too, but in the other direction?

The problem with so many big-talking cop defenders like the OP is that they are so keen to stomp all over any criticism that they turn from defenders of good cops into apologists for bad ones. That's the only way to explain numbers like "99.9%."
I'm not a big-talking cop defender except for when I rant. :) Like I said, the 99.9 thing was not meant to be taken literally. I agree that something has to be done to lower the numbers of bad cops, probably something drastic. I never said there were no bad cops. But I do believe that the media portrays cops as much, much worse than they actually are. At the end of the day, when you are the victim of a crime, the cops (generally) are the ones you want at your side.
acting like bullies happens far more than simple-minded morons like the OP are willing to admit. Because if 99.9 percent of cops were, in fact, great cops, we'd hear virtually no stories about police intimidation or brutality or illegal activities.
Alright, I'm very sorry for the hyperbole. It was out of line and is causing a huge hijack. Now can we stop with the insults? (Although that was pretty mild for the Pit...)

If good cops were more willing to denounce and help get rid of the bad cops instead of protecting and covering for them i would be a lot more willing to give them any respect. The way i see it there is bad cops and those who enable them to continue being bad cops.
That is true. I am not sure exactly how much a good cop can do to stop a bad cop without risking personal damage (And if the police looses a good cop because he tried to take down a bad cop, the loss of the good cop could arguablly do more damage than the shutting down of a bad cop).

Nothing would benefit the police force more than the weeding out of bad cops, and the fact that the force hasn't done this yet is probably its biggest flaw. But comments that compare cops in general to Nazis dishonor the good cops, who are still the majority.
 
I know if the pay of LEO's was any shittier, only psychopaths and idealists would want to join up, but what would be the benefits of paying them even more money?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20070822184906AAdD4QM
Detroit cops make 47,500 base and wind up at about 60,000 a year. I don't think that is shitty, especially when Detroit is so financially depressed.

I didn't think it was shitty. I was referring to the post above mentioning how much more money they were worth, and just suggesting that he thought their current wages were "shitty".
 
So if the drug dealer looks like he's taking out a gun and is about to fire it, the officer should wait until he gets hit by the first bullet before firing back? I know someone gave an example of a cop who did wait and it turned out to not be a gun, but in that example, if the woman had a pistol, she could have shot and killed the cop, or an innocent bystander.
This reply has fuck-all to do what I said. You'd get more praise for cops in general if you raised it in the instance of a thread in which a cop does something decent. What you're trying here is a bit like trying to get someone to say wonderful things about priests in the latest pedophillia coverup thread. It kind of grates.
 
That is true. I am not sure exactly how much a good cop can do to stop a bad cop without risking personal damage (And if the police looses a good cop because he tried to take down a bad cop, the loss of the good cop could arguablly do more damage than the shutting down of a bad cop).

It's sad that the "no snitches" mentality is a lot stronger among the supposed good guys than the bad guys they chase.
 
This reply has fuck-all to do what I said. You'd get more praise for cops in general if you raised it in the instance of a thread in which a cop does something decent. What you're trying here is a bit like trying to get someone to say wonderful things about priests in the latest pedophillia coverup thread. It kind of grates.

I personally am not Christian and therefore would not be likely to write a rant defending priests, who don't actually effect me. But if I were a person who was helped by a priest, and I saw a large group of people who think that all priests or at least, the great majority of them are child molestors, I'd defend priests, too. Is that wrong?

Since I know how much police officers do help us, I chose to defend them.
 
If the majority of police officers were so altruistic, they should be willing to do the job for a minimum wage. Nobody is forcing them to take such a challenging job.
 
Why view them as all good or as bad? They're human beings. There are good ones and bad ones. It's like saying that we shouldn't complain about politicians because only a few are bad. I don't see what's wrong about calling attention to the corrupt ones. It doesn't mean they're all horrible.
 
Why view them as all good or as bad? They're human beings. There are good ones and bad ones. It's like saying that we shouldn't complain about politicians because only a few are bad. I don't see what's wrong about calling attention to the corrupt ones. It doesn't mean they're all horrible.

Except that I'm not saying "don't complain about the bad cops because there are so few of them" but "don't label all cops as evil because some are regretfully bad, a problem that should be fixed".
 
But cops don't have unadulterated power. They are subject to the law (At least in theory, although in some places that is not the case. But the bad cops are not the problem in those places, the whole society is).

This seems to me to be a bit naive. They're subject to the law, but only insofar as their bad acts can be proven. There's obviously a high degree of cohesion in police forces, the natural presumption to trusting policemen over lay men, and the wide, wide berth that the law gives police to act with force in "reasonable" situations all add up to them having a lot of power that is unrestrained in any meaningful sense by "the law"

Care to share your experience? I'm not saying you're lying or anything like that, I just want to hear why you think that so I can make my own judgement.

Sure, my experience is with my own eyes. European and Canadian cops (my other experience with western-style police firsthand) on average do not appear to be as militarized in their demeanor (buzz cuts, permanent steel faced menacing glare, a generalized "fuck off" attitude about them) and exude a far more genial attitude to the citizenry they police.
 
Who on this board ever said cops have the right to "assault , rob or murder anyone they please"?
I said "in this country", not on this board. This board is pretty centrist; while America is nigh-fascist in its worship of cops and soldiers.

If we have any "worship" for soldiers, policemen and firemen, its because they by and large are decent people doing a yeoman's job for low pay and are providing necessary services/protection/etcetera. True, there are many many crazies and morons on a power trip in all of these areas, and I wish we did a better job of screening them out and getting rid of them, but these people are appreciated for the job(s) they do because its not a job just anyone can do or would be willing to do so.

On the surface, all are noble professions all things considered. And relatively thankless, despite your assertion of worship and flag-waving.

And we aren't anywhere close to being a fascist country. That notion is just absurd.
 
edit: I would feel far more comfortable mouthing off and exerting my rights to a Canadian or European cop than your local bubba in rural 'murrika.
 
I heard a noise in front of my house. The cops had pulled over a couple teens. They were being very abusive and nasty to them. I went to the front yard and pretended to trim my front tree. The cop yelled at me and told me to go back in my home. I asked him what he was talking about and he bitched at me for a while threatening me with arrest for not following a police order. He eventually calmed down and went away. I felt like I saved the kids a beating.
Aww, aren't you just a super hero savior.

Yep.
 
If the majority of police officers were so altruistic, they should be willing to do the job for a minimum wage. Nobody is forcing them to take such a challenging job.

One could say the same thing about doctors, lawyers, firefighters, and pretty much anyone else who does a job they like because they like helping other people.
 
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