Bill Smith
New member
he be Philip I or II? In other words, would "King Philip," the husband of Mary I who jointly ruled England with his wife during her lifetime, count in the ordinal numbering of monarchs?
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If someone called "Philip" were to inherit the throne of the United Kingdom, would
- Thread starter Bill Smith
- Start date
No, because Philip II of Spain is not included as a Monarch otherwise he would have taken the throne after his wife's death. The only true Joint Monarchy was William III and Mary II.
If we had a king who ruled using the name Philip he would by King Philip (no number unless there was later King Philip) - Queen Elizabeth I was just known as Queen Elizabeth (of England) until 1952.
If we had a king who ruled using the name Philip he would by King Philip (no number unless there was later King Philip) - Queen Elizabeth I was just known as Queen Elizabeth (of England) until 1952.
Phillip I. Mary I husband was only created a king consort (something that has not been done since in the United Kingdom or its constituent realms probably because of how unpopular he was a King (consort)). Only a reigning king gets the numerals. Like in the case of William III who was actually created co sovereign with his wife.
Diana Tais
New member
Yes, Philip of Spain was King Regnant of England.
Under the terms of the marriage treaty, Philip was to enjoy Mary I's titles and honours for as long as their marriage should last. Their joint royal style (after Philip ascended the Spanish throne in 1556) was: Philip and Mary, by the Grace of God King and Queen of England, Spain, France, Jerusalem, both the Sicilies and Ireland, Defenders of the Faith, Archdukes of Austria, Dukes of Burgundy, Milan and Brabant, Counts of Habsburg, Flanders and Tirol.
Acts which made it high treason to deny Philip's royal authority were passed in Ireland and England. The Privy Council instructed that Philip and Mary should be joint signatories of royal documents, and this was enacted by an Act of Parliament. As the new King of England could not read English, it was ordered that a note of all matters of state should be made in Latin or Spanish. Philip and Mary appeared on coins together, with a single crown suspended between them as a symbol of joint reign. The Great Seal shows Philip and Mary seated on thrones, holding the crown together. The coat of arms of England was impaled with Philip's to denote their joint reign. All official documents, including Acts of Parliament, were to be dated with both their names, and Parliament was to be called under the joint authority of the couple.
The numeral of the next British Monarch ascending to the Throne under the name “Philip” is debatable; both Philip I and Philip II are possible. Although Philip of Spain (Queen Mary I’s husband) was King Regnant of England and Ireland, it was only for the duration of their marriage, so he’s often not mentioned in the list of 'proper' Monarchs (the ones which usually omit Empress Matilda and Jane Grey as well).
The reason why the next “King Philip” may chose to be known as “Philip I”, rather than “Philip II”, is that Philip is not exactly a very popular figure in English/British history. The wars he wages against France (and which England supported, although a special clause in the terms of the marriage treaty stipulated that Mary wasting obliged to support Philip's wars) cost England its last bastion on the mainland – the port Calais. And of course, it was Philip who sent the Spanish Armada to invade England during the reign of Elizabeth I.
Under the terms of the marriage treaty, Philip was to enjoy Mary I's titles and honours for as long as their marriage should last. Their joint royal style (after Philip ascended the Spanish throne in 1556) was: Philip and Mary, by the Grace of God King and Queen of England, Spain, France, Jerusalem, both the Sicilies and Ireland, Defenders of the Faith, Archdukes of Austria, Dukes of Burgundy, Milan and Brabant, Counts of Habsburg, Flanders and Tirol.
Acts which made it high treason to deny Philip's royal authority were passed in Ireland and England. The Privy Council instructed that Philip and Mary should be joint signatories of royal documents, and this was enacted by an Act of Parliament. As the new King of England could not read English, it was ordered that a note of all matters of state should be made in Latin or Spanish. Philip and Mary appeared on coins together, with a single crown suspended between them as a symbol of joint reign. The Great Seal shows Philip and Mary seated on thrones, holding the crown together. The coat of arms of England was impaled with Philip's to denote their joint reign. All official documents, including Acts of Parliament, were to be dated with both their names, and Parliament was to be called under the joint authority of the couple.
The numeral of the next British Monarch ascending to the Throne under the name “Philip” is debatable; both Philip I and Philip II are possible. Although Philip of Spain (Queen Mary I’s husband) was King Regnant of England and Ireland, it was only for the duration of their marriage, so he’s often not mentioned in the list of 'proper' Monarchs (the ones which usually omit Empress Matilda and Jane Grey as well).
The reason why the next “King Philip” may chose to be known as “Philip I”, rather than “Philip II”, is that Philip is not exactly a very popular figure in English/British history. The wars he wages against France (and which England supported, although a special clause in the terms of the marriage treaty stipulated that Mary wasting obliged to support Philip's wars) cost England its last bastion on the mainland – the port Calais. And of course, it was Philip who sent the Spanish Armada to invade England during the reign of Elizabeth I.
Although Philip of Spain was recognized as King and co-ruler during his marriage to Mary I of England, it was made clear from the first that that role would end with her death, as it did. His position was actually only that of king consort. The only REAL co-monarchs of England or Great Britain were WIlliam III and Mary II, who were the son-in-law and daughter of James II. In their case, although Mary, who had a closer claim to the throne, died first, William continued to reign until his death. If a man named Philip ever became King of England/Great Britain/the UK, he would be simply Philip (as Kings Stephen and John and Queens Anne and Victoria, as the only monarchs with their respective names, are numberless) until a second Philip ascended the throne, at which time the one and only Philip would become known as Philip I.
Nightwind: Mwa ha ha!
New member
An interesting question. After all, in the case of William and Mary, William was included in the numbering scheme, even though it was his wife who inherited the crown. (He was William III, and the UK later had a William IV)
However, William is regularly counted in lists of English and British monarchs, and Philip is not. A lot of people don't even realize Philip was recognized as king of England.
So I'm honstly not sure what they would do if we ever had a King Philip. However, since monarchs can take whatever name they want (it doesn't have to be a birth name), and they generally take something meaningful, I find it unlikely a British monarch will every choose the name Philip for himself....the same reason we haven't had a second King John in 800 years.
However, William is regularly counted in lists of English and British monarchs, and Philip is not. A lot of people don't even realize Philip was recognized as king of England.
So I'm honstly not sure what they would do if we ever had a King Philip. However, since monarchs can take whatever name they want (it doesn't have to be a birth name), and they generally take something meaningful, I find it unlikely a British monarch will every choose the name Philip for himself....the same reason we haven't had a second King John in 800 years.