My two republican friends think that just because illegal immigrants come to the united states, they are taking our jobs and "not being grateful." I totally disagree with this. How do I argue to them that this is not true, this is a free country and the reason they come here is to try to have a better life? It frustrates me so much that they think this way.
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How can I argue to my friends who believe "foreign people are taking all our jobs"?
- Thread starter lou
- Start date
jeeper_peeper321
New member
You cannot, it is true.
Illegals drive down the wages paid to american workers.
When you can hire an illegal to do construction for $8.00 an hour, what companies are going to pay americans $15.00 an hour to do the same job.
The factory where I worked hired illegals.
Everyone at this factory, was hired from an private employment agency, after 90 days they are supposed to be rolled over to become a company employee and start receiving the company wages and benefits.
Except the company decided to just leave them with the employment agency making $5.00 a hour less for up to two years.
This quickly dried up any american applying for a job, since they did not want to make the lower wage for two years, before being rolled over.
This in turn, made it possible for the company to NOT give regular pay raises to the regular employees, since they did not have to have competitive wages with the other factories in the area who did not hire illegals.
It is not so much that they take jobs, as it is they drive wages down on jobs americans had been doing.
There is no incentive for companies to raise wages, when they can hire people for alot less money.
And with 15 million illegals in the US, thats a huge downward push on the average wages paid.
Right now, the average cost of a fake US State drivers license and SS car and number for an illegal is $400.00.
Which makes it almost impossible for companies to know or find out the employees are here illegaly.
There was a company in Conn that had an active program to make sure its employees were not illegals.
Their program was so effective, that they actualy recieved a letter from the US Justice department, telling them to stop, thats its not their job to stop illegal aliens.
Then a year and a half later, the INS raided their plant and found illegals that had been hired After the Justice department told them to stop.
And the INS tried to give them a huge fine, for hiring illegals.
Illegals drive down the wages paid to american workers.
When you can hire an illegal to do construction for $8.00 an hour, what companies are going to pay americans $15.00 an hour to do the same job.
The factory where I worked hired illegals.
Everyone at this factory, was hired from an private employment agency, after 90 days they are supposed to be rolled over to become a company employee and start receiving the company wages and benefits.
Except the company decided to just leave them with the employment agency making $5.00 a hour less for up to two years.
This quickly dried up any american applying for a job, since they did not want to make the lower wage for two years, before being rolled over.
This in turn, made it possible for the company to NOT give regular pay raises to the regular employees, since they did not have to have competitive wages with the other factories in the area who did not hire illegals.
It is not so much that they take jobs, as it is they drive wages down on jobs americans had been doing.
There is no incentive for companies to raise wages, when they can hire people for alot less money.
And with 15 million illegals in the US, thats a huge downward push on the average wages paid.
Right now, the average cost of a fake US State drivers license and SS car and number for an illegal is $400.00.
Which makes it almost impossible for companies to know or find out the employees are here illegaly.
There was a company in Conn that had an active program to make sure its employees were not illegals.
Their program was so effective, that they actualy recieved a letter from the US Justice department, telling them to stop, thats its not their job to stop illegal aliens.
Then a year and a half later, the INS raided their plant and found illegals that had been hired After the Justice department told them to stop.
And the INS tried to give them a huge fine, for hiring illegals.
Arcanum Noctis
New member
But...it is the truth, which you are also giving the truth too.
Just simplify the issue to the fact that there are immigrants that came here illegally and are screwing over immigrants that are here legally. Thats not right.
Just simplify the issue to the fact that there are immigrants that came here illegally and are screwing over immigrants that are here legally. Thats not right.
First of all what does illegal mean to you? It in my opinion means that entering this country illegally is a crime.
Therefore it would appear from your question that you feel that breaking the law is okay however we all know that there is a right way to become an American citizen that being to follow the appropriate procedure to become a naturalized citizen.
As far as I am concerned anyone who is in the United States illegally should be rounded up arrested and turned over to the immigration authorities. Returned to their respective countries and if they wish to become an America citizen they can learn the language and enter the country legally. After all if California's governor can do it others can do it as well.
As it turns out your republican friends are correct. It is not just lettuce and tomato pickers being employed it is engineers, medical personnel and other jobs that are also being taken. Many are being paid under the table thus they are not paying taxes. They pay nothing into Medicare or Social Security yet we have some in our congress that feel that illegal immigrants should be able to benefit from programs that were set up for Americans who do pay into such programs.
By the end of the year the illegal immigrants end up with more money yet also access to programs that are paid for by our legal American taxpayers.
You have no argument, this is a free country however we do have laws and allowing illegals to breaking them is certainly not fare to those citizens who work within the law.
Therefore it would appear from your question that you feel that breaking the law is okay however we all know that there is a right way to become an American citizen that being to follow the appropriate procedure to become a naturalized citizen.
As far as I am concerned anyone who is in the United States illegally should be rounded up arrested and turned over to the immigration authorities. Returned to their respective countries and if they wish to become an America citizen they can learn the language and enter the country legally. After all if California's governor can do it others can do it as well.
As it turns out your republican friends are correct. It is not just lettuce and tomato pickers being employed it is engineers, medical personnel and other jobs that are also being taken. Many are being paid under the table thus they are not paying taxes. They pay nothing into Medicare or Social Security yet we have some in our congress that feel that illegal immigrants should be able to benefit from programs that were set up for Americans who do pay into such programs.
By the end of the year the illegal immigrants end up with more money yet also access to programs that are paid for by our legal American taxpayers.
You have no argument, this is a free country however we do have laws and allowing illegals to breaking them is certainly not fare to those citizens who work within the law.
You Need Me!
New member
The way to a better life does not start with being a criminal.
Third Party
New member
Immigration HELPS corporations, by flooding the labor pool.
Immigration HURTS the working class, by flooding the labor pool.
If your friends are TRULY Republicans, they will be happy at this bit of news.
Immigration HURTS the working class, by flooding the labor pool.
If your friends are TRULY Republicans, they will be happy at this bit of news.
Lou, it's like this. There is one big pie that we baked. Everybody gets to have a piece. If "others" are allowed to illegally sneak into America they will get somebody's piece of pie and that person that got his or her pie stolen will be angry and hate the people that stole their piece. You say "they" want a better life. Let them build a better life where they are and stay the hell out of our America. And leave our PIE alone!
- nokilleye -
New member
I'm not a republican with an agenda, I'm a socialist, so this is not an anti-foreigner rant but the unfortunate truth is that foreigners are here to take our jobs (not because they're devious or malicious but because a 'free global trade' mad congress and white house (I'm assuming you're US but even if you're UK, this probably still applies, except for the "congress & white house") have orchestrated this for thirty years. I work in predominantly residential construction and in my anecdotal experience, I have witnessed the purging of indigenous Americans from a job market that is now about 90% eastern European, Mexican and south American immigrant. Jobs that can be performed in front of a computer or on a telephone have all been shipped overseas and for those jobs that can't be done remotely, a flood of hungry immigrants have been shipped in to do for less. This is a planned economy and the plan is slashing wages and eliminating benefits. Foreigners aren't coming here to take our jobs - Our government under the control of private enterprise is bringing them here to give them our jobs. On that technicality, your friends are sort of wrong. If you like to argue and challenge, present them with that argument. If they are so impassioned about the situation then they ought to appreciate the proper assignment of blame.
Halfwords McGill
New member
You can't. Illegal immigrants ARE coming here and taking our jobs. Not only that, but American companies are moving jobs overseas.
Your friends are at least part right. Unfortunately, we cant have the things that we have here unless we take on some of that cheap labor. My problem with illegal immigrants is that they come here to try and make a better life .... but then they don't. They end up sucking up all the benefits, that I believe they shouldn't have.
Your friends are at least part right. Unfortunately, we cant have the things that we have here unless we take on some of that cheap labor. My problem with illegal immigrants is that they come here to try and make a better life .... but then they don't. They end up sucking up all the benefits, that I believe they shouldn't have.