Dubs that changed the music for the better?

Oh, it's a blanket statement alrighty, but it's true (assuming we're speakin' the terms of fact, rather than opinion). If one hates the original...than they hate the original. Their opinion is based on that. Hating or liking the replacement score has no baring because it isn't the actual music of the series. You're supposed to be watching Japanese animation and the story all of the different components of the actual staff have put together to make their product. Replacing the music and sound effects, changing the story and animation, that defeats the purpose in the first place. Sure, there's something to be said for dubs (i.e. using different actors across different versions) existing as all different renditions of theatrical plays have across the years and the lanRAB...but that's different.


Bah, I promised I wouldn't write a dozen paragraphs for this thread, but I'll comment on the 'action statement', now that it's has been brought up (and this is in no way not meant to be a general statement). Such is a term I've seen tossed around the internet quite a bit, that "Dragon Ball Z is an action show." I don't really like that description (you'll notice I'm not making this a matter of fact ). Dragon Ball has always been a very old school martial arts film inspired series. It's not all about guns, borabs, crashing cars, explosions, etc. etc. as a series like Lost can sometimes be, or Justice League was (although I suppose you'd call Justice League a superhero show instead, as you would the Dragon Ball stuff martial arts). It's always been very focused on both adventure and straight-up [what I like to call] 'super martial arts', rather than the sort of 'action' one might attribute to a Saturday morning cartoon series (although with the 'refreshed' Dragon Ball Kai airing on the Japanese quivalent of Saturday mornings with a more rockish/modern score I suppose there's an entirely different argument to be had there ). Espicially Shunsuke with Kikuchi's musical score. You go and watch even the Saiyan arc (and arcs later on) or some of the films and you'll instantly hear orchestration that will remind you less of "EXPLOSIONS!! EXTREME!! HARDCORE!!!" as you would with the Faulconer score, and more of intricate instrumentations working together to create both the general light and quirky Toriyama world, but also big and sweeping epic scores (the biggest examples I remeraber on hand would be the first three Dragon Ball Z films, although the score for the second Dragon Ball film is absolutely astounding in its range as well). Thinking back, Kikuchi's work actually reminRAB me of the score from Kung Fu Hustle--in of itself a big throwback to the old school kung fu films of the seventies and eighties.


And now, to cut the front yard...!!
 
Sailor Moon had good music for it's own dub especially the song when one of the girls had a problem, although it is just reprises of the same song. It also did have good original songs especially Rainy Day Man.
 
As far as Dragonball is concerned, while I do enjoy Faulconer's music more than Kikuchi's, Kikuchi's score for the original Dragon Ball is brilliant and I'm glad FUNi didn't use Faulconer's music for it. It has a lighthearted, fun tone that fits perfectly with the tone of the series.

When the series went from "wacky martial arts adventure" to "ultra sci-fi epic battle for the universe" in Dragonball Z, I feel Kikuchi's work didn't evolve along with the series enough. That's why I like Faulconer's score better for Z.

One piece of music from Z I adore from Kikuchi is the piece that plays when Trunks becomes a Super Saiyan when fighting Freeza.
 
So what about someone who loves the original? I think the original version of Sailor Moon is 100 times better than the dub, but in one scene in particular, I think that the dub made a good choice in changing the song. That would be when sailor moon first turns into the moon princess. The original was song was good but I liked the replacement song better. So in my opinion at that moment the staff working on the dub made a good

And I think your missing the point that the opinion of what's better/the best is subjective too. "The original is always the best" is not a factual statement. Someone could like the dub of a show better because it appeals to them more than the original Japanese version. Therefore for them to say the dub is the best version is not an incorrect statement, but their opinion.

Edit: Nevermind. I just saw the part where you changed your first sentence. (even though I still disagree)
 
It's not a dub's place to tweak a series to make it "better," especially when it comes to music. A good dub, by definition, is one that is as accurate to the original production as practically possible. Let the series stand on its own merits. If the dub is bad, then it should be so because the original material was bad to begin with. Not because of the dub itself deciding to change things.

There are exceptions of course. Some really young-child oriented series probably wouldn't be affected for better or worse either way. There's also comedic dubs I've liked such as those for Bo-Bobo and Shin-chan, where things like music and script have been changed, arguably for the better. But they're exceptions because they're so goofy and nonsensical to begin with. But for a dub of a more serious, plot-and-tone-oriented series, even relatively simple shonen favorites like Dragon Ball Z and One Piece... Nope. Dubbers have no business changing things willy nilly.
 
now that it is mentioned some of falconer's music was actually not as bad. Comparing goku's ssj3 transformation, for example, I thought the music was much better in the dub than in the original because for the level goku attained, the music was just so darn...
subtle
with falconer, it was sorta made what it was meant to. Also with perfect cell that theme was extremely catchy...

I will also concede with digimon tamers as some pretty good music as well as a few other choice moments in digimon.
 
Yeah, as music, I like a few of the Faulconer tracks too. But as a matter of principle, it shouldn't be there. Replacing music in a dub is bad practice.

Even cheap-ass, random, obscure, no-talent dubs from third-world countries have enough common sense to just keep the original music in DBZ. FUNimation thought they were special back in the day.
 
^^Well it was their first show. I give em a little leverage (a little)

You know what I really liked? The dub opening to Digimon Frontier. It has nothing on the original "FIRE!" opening but compared to the other ones, it was perfect.
 
Yeah, same here for the most part. Water under the bridge, even though it's left a bit of a stigma. At least they're trying to make up for past mistakes with stuff like the Dragon Boxes.

Also, the Pokemon dub's original theme song (whatever the title is supposed to be) is every bit as good as Mezase Pokemon Master.
 
No that's still not a fact that's an opinion. First is not always best. It often is but that is not always the case.



It has baring on whether or not I like the other adaptation just as the music in Kai has baring on whether or not I like that adaptation of Dragon Ball.



Then I guess DBK defeats the purpose as well.



No that sounRAB about right actually. Interpretations of the characters and how they should sound differs. Dragon Ball began as a manga. The only original is the manga. The anime is but one adaptation as is DBK as is FUNimation's dub as is the spanish dub, etc. Each came from the Japanese anime based on the manga but just as DBK is not better or worse than DBZ I'd say you can't outright say any other version is inferior if it has it's own merrits. Granted some dubs are inferior but not all of them. Music in the audio track is the same DBZ and DBK have different scores with different tones to them. Does that make the original better than Kai's score? That would be a matter of opinion.

Of course music (unless it's in Japanese and they want to dub it) has no reason to be changed because music is the universal language. So it doesn't have to be in English for most dub viewers to enjoy it as the Japanese viewers did. Which is why music replacement is especially stupid. But in the case of it actually happening and another score is made for a series it's a matter of opinion as to which score suits the series better.

Yeah that paragraph about "action music"... martial arts relates heavily to action also often adventure but fighting is action. "Dragonball Z the greatest action cartoon ever made" as Toonami put it (at least until Naruto came along ). There is an adventure aspect as well and I don't make light of that but when things are going kaboom the happy go lucky music just ain't working for me. It's great for Dragon Ball with the adventures of kid Goku and it's not out of place in martial arts tournaments though I'm not seeing reserablance to Kung-Fu movie music really. But I find it rather dull for those crazy off the wall fights. To put it simply, I feel One Piece did it better and that old DBZ score just doesn't do it for me. That doesn't mean it's bad, it's a great score. I just don't think it really fits DBZ's more intense moments. Neither does Falcouner's really it just drones on and on but I like epic fight music and Falcouner's can deliver that on occasion. I know you love that score to death but again this is all a matter of opinion as is your opinion (not fact).

So let's leave it at that.
 
going to have to disagree here and leave it to discretion of the dubbing company. As far as voice acting goes, its extremely annoying to hear a voice actor/actress going the direct vocal pitch of the japanese version and it makes the dub in itself lack creativity and true acting. One thing I attribute funimation for is hiring voice actors that ACTUALLY act by taking the character and transforming the character based on their own vocal suits. A great example of this is Romeo x Juliet, to which I honestly contend is probably one of the best dubs of last year.

It is a different conversation entirely (and I don't want to get into the original voice acting and dubbing) but the stereotyped voices of japanese anime completely and utterly annoys me as a watcher and leaves me a bit negative in many regarRAB. There are several exceptions but it seems to be a growing trend

As far as music goes, again that's a catch 22. While one can definitely understand (especially if the score is fantastic) that they may not want to hear a different score, sometimes budgeting and time constraints you have to do what you can. Sometimes the product is amazing and on par with the orchestral score. Other times, it isn't. Yugioh is one of those cases. By choice, I would rather listen to the dub tracks than the original score because it honestly felt so much more serious and conveyed the intention much better than the bubble gum pop that the japanese score had. For once, it was like the shoe was on the other foot.

That said, some of the pokemon music was also good and I honestly cannot forget pokemon either. But in general I thought this would be an interesting discussion to gauge a person's opinion on the basis of musical taste.
 
Hmmm, no, FUNi didn't think they were special back in the day. Even you should know how U.S action cartoon work. Adding classical music will be broing for an action cartoon show, but with rock and metal, nope.
Well, thats how they think back than. I think.
 
I agree with this for the most part. That's why I made sure to say, "as accurate as practically possible." When it comes to voices, the important part is the characterization. You don't have to mimic the original voice to stay accurate. Sean Schemmel's Goku is (or at least, has become) a good example of that. When given a good script, he's great and portrays Goku's personality splendidly.

But music is a different story. The choice in background music serves to set the overall tone and attitude of a scene or even an entire series. Drastically changing that changes a core part of the series' presentation.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHQhrabroadbf1M4
This is some of the most inappropriate background music I ever heard.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bf4nRbBve88

It's not the best but at least it feels proper.
 
Jacob, just because everyone in this thread didn't take the trouble to append "but that's just my subjective opinion and you're equally entitled to your own" to each and every little thing they've posted does NOT mean they're trying to set up their opinion as a matter of fact. In fact, the only person in this thread I see doing that is you. I really, really need you to back down a little here.
 
Something in me really really likes Sailor Moon's dub music used for the transformation scene. I could listen to it for hours on looped track because it sounRAB so heroic.

It just said, "Better respect now, *****es, I'm bringing out the wand."
 
I thought the score 4KiRAB used for One Piece was amazing. Truly a step up from the Japanese version, which does nothing to inspire overtures of adventure and romance, and hardly ever appears in the first place.

... No, I'm kidding! Put down the pitchforks!

On a serious note, Shaman King. The Japanese score wasn't that great, so replacing it didn't have much consequence on the quality of the show.
 
The Laputa rescore is one of the few things in that dub that actually turned out by and large superior to its immediate predecessor.

Shame they took it out for the new dvd though.
 
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