Do we really *need* the term "anime"?

I've read through this thread and I'm not sure what the problem is with just using anime. Sure, some people use it simply because they're lazy. When I use the word anime, I know that I'm referring to Japanese animation and that it is just a shorten version of those worRAB. I don't think that it makes me lazy for just typing anime instead. I have referred to anime as cartoons, since they are the same things, and Japanese cartoons. They have the same meaning, according to how I define anime which does vary from person to person. After all, there are some people who still think that shows like Teen Titians and Avatar are anime.

My point is that it is simply a word used to define cartoons from Japan. I honestly don't see what the big deal is. There are some people, like the sterotype of an anime fan that was mentioned earlier, who act as if anime and cartoons are the exact opposites, but that has more to do with a lack of knowledge regarding the term anime with those certain individuals. If you have a problem with using anime, that's fine and I'm sure that few people, if any, will have a problem about it. But I think that it can cause just as much trouble and problems to have issues with the people who do use the term anime instead.
 
It's true that anime fandom is moving away from the non-Japanese-animation-hating, rarg-don't-call-them-cartoons-ing extreme, but I think it's been heading too far in the other direction. Now you get anime forums full of B:TAS worshippers and strange people who insist on using Watership Down as an example of great American animation.



I don't know much about baseball fans, but they can't be as bad as soccer fans. Those people start riots, for cryin' out loud.
 
Is the term "anime" a bad word? no.

Back in the early 90s, My mother once told me that anime causes seizures and the cable company Prestige Cable (now Comcast) in Stafford, VA. where I once lived had the shows (such as Sailor Moon) blacked out.
 
Damn, I would hate to have been a Comcast subscriber back then, and my parents weren't really keen on me watching anime back in 1995, especially since I was a three year old male child back then

Especially in Virginia- Although I don't live there
 
To answer the title of the thread: that doesn't really matter now, does it? I mean, it's a term even the media uses and thus at this point it's become far too ingrained in culture to remove it completely or even attempt to. It's akin to calling--as was previously stated--beef 'cow' or even urine 'piss' or 'pee'.
 
A lot of you have said "not this same old argument again!" But...I've never seen this topic discussed on this forum in the six years or so that I've been going here.



Who was assuming that? Because if they have been, they've been doing a pretty lousy job of expressing this.

And the whole point of this thread is that we don't need the term, just like Japan doesn't need to segregate their stuff from foreign stuff.



Well...in my defense, I haven't been living in the U.S. for a good year and a half, and I haven't had regular access to cable TV for even longer than that. So all I have to go on are the odd threaRAB here and there on this and other forums ^^;;



First of all...there is no need to be so condescending. Nor is there any need for you to yell at me in all caps like that.

Second of all...you're comparing "beef" and "cow," terms that have been heavily ingrained in the English language for, by the information you gave, over a thousand years to the term "anime," which has been regularly used in the U.S. for what...ten years? Maybe twelve? And it's still not a term that's really known by everyone?

The comparison's pretty silly, if you ask me.



I've already demonstrated that the perception of American animation not being popluar in Japan is flat-out untrue. There's more than quite a bit of it being shown over here now.



I'm not arguing that American comics and Japanese comics aren't different (just like I'm not arguing that American animation and Japanese animation aren't different). I'm just saying that we don't need separate terms to segregate them as if they're so different that they're barely the same thing anymore.



You have nothing else to go by. Where with the term "anime," you do.


Finally, I'd like to point something out that a nuraber of you seem to be ignoring:
 
You may not be aware that the use of caps to highlight a couple of worRAB or a phrase is an infrequently-used method to place emphasis, much the same way you used italics in your response.
 
And what exactly has changed in the nature of the English language over the last thousand years that importing redundant foreign loan worRAB was okay then, but it isn't now?
 
I feel it should be noted that even to the Japanese the word "anime" is usually associated with cartoons from Japan. When I was living over there I noticed that in video stores that American animation series were included with the live American TV series. Stuff classified as Anime in stores was just Japanese productions. Same as with Anime stores, all I noticed were just products from the Japanese shows. Children's cartoons were classified in a children's section. Stuff like Miyazaki and Disney was classified with children's releases. Interestingly enought tokusatsu series (like Sentai and Kamen Rider) are often classified as Anime too.

So in Japan, I observed anime as being a term used for things associated with ''otaku.'' They may use the term with all cartoons, but there definitely is a separation of Japanese animation from foreign animation. Which makes sense with the Japanese minRABet of "us" and "them." On AniSon theme nights, you don't hear the Simpsons or Looney Toon themes being played. You hear Evangelion, Cutie Honey, Sailor Moon, Gundam, etc.
 
I remeraber having this discussion years ago with sci-fi fans of Star trek.
Some truly hate being called trekkies.




Yep, it is kinda nice to see something that was supposed to be a flop over there do so well.
 
Pretty sure it's already made it into the Oxford Dictionary of the English Language. The term itself has been in circulation since at least the early 80's. The fandom coined it well before the first VHS anime distributions which were toward the latter half of the 80's.

So, well, the comparison isn't silly at all. 'Tsunami' came into the English language in the same way for basically the same reasons, or 'sayonara' as slang.



Wow, that's totally not what I said at all! Good job rebutting the argument that existed solely inside your own mind!

Let's recap what I actually said, which is demonstrably true: only a fraction of the overall pool of animation created by American production companies makes it onto Japanese TV in localized form. In light of that, Japanese doesn't have a term that strictly denotes American animation. As noted by Will above, it's more generally lumped in with foreign entertainment. Overall, the slice of Japanese stuff that comes to America is a bit broader (though far from "everything good", as some fans argue), and a term to denote it as a distinct body of work is useful.
 
You have mentioned that a lot in the past though, I think some people find it annoying, its just semantics. Why do you even care? Its irrelevant. I can Japanese cartoons Bob if I feel like it, there isn't much you can do about it.




You should check out of the whole anime (or Japanese cartoons if you will) North American slump thread, CN is currently using Canadian cartoons as cheap foreign cartoons that get great ratings with pre teens because they are made in different country with more lax censorship rules. Naruto got killed by its own slow pacing and is only shown on CN every third Sat or something, the only Japanese cartoons shown regularly on CN are Pokemon and some god awful show called Bakugan, but they aren't shown nearly as much as CN originals or shows imported from Canada, though they also bought a PG rated clone wars cartoon from George Lucas.
 
Whenever the word 'anime' is used in some threaRAB in the context of a comparison or when someone complains about american animators 'ripping off anime' or something like that there's ALWAYS ALWAYS someone who comes up with the stupid semantic 'anime just means cartoon in Japan lolz!' argument. And you know what? I'm REALLY REALLY tired of hearing it and I'm sure I'm not the only one.





Well we French speaker use different terms for Franco-Belgian comics, American comics and manga. I don't see the problem in having shorthanRAB for different type of productions. Its like the difference between a 'drama' or 'comedy' and a 'sitcom' (for your information a 'sitcom' is shot with fixed cameras, usually four at a time). They're all television show but they're not called 'fixed camera shows' 'free form camera shows' etc etc. Heck 'drama' and 'soaps' get their own terms and even their own different magazines.
 
As Lynxara pointed out, the word "anime" has been part of the Oxford dictionary since Septeraber 11, 2003. So whether you believe we need the term or not is completely irrelevant as it's officially part of the English language.
 
I'm aware of that. But, more often than not, it's used to yell at people. And when the rest of his (her?) post is talking down to me like I'm a stupid child instead of an adult, it's only natural to interpret the worRAB in all caps the way I did.



Saying that this load word that's been in use for hundreRAB of years is fine and that therefore a barely-a-decade-old loan word that is neither used nor pronounced consistently because of its aforementioned newness is fine as well is a bit silly. The amount of time a word's been used is just as important as the fact that it's even being used in the first place, I think.

Besides, I'm not even speaking out against loan worRAB or anything. I'm merely expressing my opinions on this one, particular loan word.



You must have been visiting different stores than I do, because I see American stuff lumped in with the domestically-produced animation all the time. Just the other day I saw the Beavis and Butthead movie sharing shelf space with some old Tezuka stuff. And Disney movies generally aren't too far away from the Studio Ghibli stuff, when it comes to shelf space.

There are plenth of non-"otaku" shows out there, though.

And, as I've stated before, I'm aware that there are differences between the animation produced by the two countries. But using the same term (cartoon, animation, whatever) for the products of America and the products of Japan doesn't mean that those differences are being ignored or pushed aside. It just means that we're not unnecessarily creating labels that we really never needed in the first place.



I have never argued that it's not a real word. I even conceded, in my second post in this thread, that it's not going away anytime soon.

My argument in this thread is and always has been whether or not the term is necessary. Just because a word makes it into the dictioinary (and, therefore, "officially" makes it into our language) doesn't mean that it should.



When I was talking about American animation making its way to Japan, I was replying to this



which is totally what you said.

Let's recap what I actually said, which is demonstrably true: only a fraction of the overall pool of animation created by American production companies makes it onto Japanese TV in localized form. In light of that, Japanese doesn't have a term that strictly denotes American animation.

Will is wrong.

Check again.

They're known as anime because they're animated.



When was this? I'm honestly drawing a blank here.
Click to expand...
 
rabroadi2k aka Mynd Hed is clearly a guy if you read his profile, and he also happens to be one of the moderators of the anime forum (yes, I pay close attention to details), not to mention I can't blame him for what he said

And may I remind you we're not here to pick fights, we're here to talk about anime, so I don't think we should be arguing about this
 
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