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Who died?
- Thread starter th2n10s4u
- Start date
tweekduece
New member
On 06/04/2011 6:32 PM, ImStillMags wrote:
I don't know why they do that. There was a big stink about that here in
Canada. Some people were adamant that the flag should be at half staff
whenever a soldier was killed over there. It is ironic that people
should make such a demand as if it were proper flag etiquette. It isn't.
The flag is only supposed to be lowered for the death of the sovereign
and for a number of specific occasions, one of them being Nov.11,
Remembrance Day. On that date it is lowered to honour all fallen
soldiers, treating them all equally. Hell, if we had flags at half staff
for each of our soldiers killed during WW I and WW II we would probably
still have the flag down.
Most soldiers know about flag etiquette and would not expect the flag to
be lowered in their honour.
I don't know why they do that. There was a big stink about that here in
Canada. Some people were adamant that the flag should be at half staff
whenever a soldier was killed over there. It is ironic that people
should make such a demand as if it were proper flag etiquette. It isn't.
The flag is only supposed to be lowered for the death of the sovereign
and for a number of specific occasions, one of them being Nov.11,
Remembrance Day. On that date it is lowered to honour all fallen
soldiers, treating them all equally. Hell, if we had flags at half staff
for each of our soldiers killed during WW I and WW II we would probably
still have the flag down.
Most soldiers know about flag etiquette and would not expect the flag to
be lowered in their honour.
littlechic110
New member
Dave Smith wrote in
news:[email protected]:
Well, as a reminder that Canadians are dying in a pointless land
war in Asia, you could not do better.
In 2006, the Conservatives "discontinued the practice" of flying
the flag at half-mast for significant deaths. The first and
nearly last time this occurred outside of circumstances of
protocol was in April 2002 when the Liberal government lowered
the flag at half-mast following the Tarnak farm incident in which
four Canadian soldiers were killed by a laser-guided 500 elbee
bomb launched from an F-16 piloted by an ill-informed Air
National Guard pilot, Maj. Harry Schmidt. The significance is
that these soldiers were the first to die in that war. Three
other incidents involving four soldiers (in 2003, 2004 and 2005)
were noted by lowering the flag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarnak_Farm_incident
If Harper could have kept it in his pants and not ratcheted up
the violence, it would not be a widespread occurence. Once a
year for four years isn't a permanent thing. But he just *had*
to play PFC Bob...
In 2008, the House passed a resolution that the flag should be
lowered to half-mast for every single military death abroad.
Harper, with his usual Tory arrogance, ignored the will of the
House.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
news:[email protected]:
Well, as a reminder that Canadians are dying in a pointless land
war in Asia, you could not do better.
In 2006, the Conservatives "discontinued the practice" of flying
the flag at half-mast for significant deaths. The first and
nearly last time this occurred outside of circumstances of
protocol was in April 2002 when the Liberal government lowered
the flag at half-mast following the Tarnak farm incident in which
four Canadian soldiers were killed by a laser-guided 500 elbee
bomb launched from an F-16 piloted by an ill-informed Air
National Guard pilot, Maj. Harry Schmidt. The significance is
that these soldiers were the first to die in that war. Three
other incidents involving four soldiers (in 2003, 2004 and 2005)
were noted by lowering the flag.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarnak_Farm_incident
If Harper could have kept it in his pants and not ratcheted up
the violence, it would not be a widespread occurence. Once a
year for four years isn't a permanent thing. But he just *had*
to play PFC Bob...
In 2008, the House passed a resolution that the flag should be
lowered to half-mast for every single military death abroad.
Harper, with his usual Tory arrogance, ignored the will of the
House.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
blissathome
New member
On 06/04/2011 7:54 PM, Michel Boucher wrote:
It is irrelevant whether or not yo thing it is a pointless war. My
issue is that there is a protocol for the lowering of the flag, and it
does not include the deaths of individual soldiers or groups of
soldiers. It is an honour reserved for the sovereign, and not
appropriate for individual soldiers. They get that honour collectively
on Nov.11.
There was a similar furor in the UK when Diana Spencer was died in a
drinking and driving accident in Paris. People were upset that the flag
was not lowered at Balmoral. The press was all bent out of shape and
claimed that the public demanded it. The thing is that the proper
protocol is that there be no flag flying there. When the queen is in
residence they fly the royal standard, and the royal standard is never
flown at half staff, not even in mourning.
People are getting carried away with lowering flags these days. Cities
do it for local politicians, policemen, firemen. Schools do it for
teachers, board members and students who have died. IMO, it is
inappropriate. The flag represents the nation and that should trump an
individual. There are many other ways to honour those who have died.
It is irrelevant whether or not yo thing it is a pointless war. My
issue is that there is a protocol for the lowering of the flag, and it
does not include the deaths of individual soldiers or groups of
soldiers. It is an honour reserved for the sovereign, and not
appropriate for individual soldiers. They get that honour collectively
on Nov.11.
There was a similar furor in the UK when Diana Spencer was died in a
drinking and driving accident in Paris. People were upset that the flag
was not lowered at Balmoral. The press was all bent out of shape and
claimed that the public demanded it. The thing is that the proper
protocol is that there be no flag flying there. When the queen is in
residence they fly the royal standard, and the royal standard is never
flown at half staff, not even in mourning.
People are getting carried away with lowering flags these days. Cities
do it for local politicians, policemen, firemen. Schools do it for
teachers, board members and students who have died. IMO, it is
inappropriate. The flag represents the nation and that should trump an
individual. There are many other ways to honour those who have died.
Raymond 007
New member
On Wed, 06 Apr 2011 19:00:25 -0400, Dave Smith
wrote:
We have a national cemetery (soldiers are buried there) near us and
the flag is usually half mast. I'm always surprised when it's not.
Honestly, I don't know what triggers the flag not to be at half mast
on those days. Maybe no soldier was killed the day before, I dunno.
--
Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
wrote:
We have a national cemetery (soldiers are buried there) near us and
the flag is usually half mast. I'm always surprised when it's not.
Honestly, I don't know what triggers the flag not to be at half mast
on those days. Maybe no soldier was killed the day before, I dunno.
--
Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
fromthegroundup
New member
Dave Smith wrote:
-snip-
The US changed their code during the last administration to allow
Governors to order flags in their state to half-staff for whatever
reason they choose.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/4/7(m).html
"In the event of the death of a present or former official . . . or
the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory,
or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of
that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National
flag shall be flown at half-staff"
NY was lowering theirs for every NY soldier killed. I see MT does
something similar. I'll bet most states do.
The problem with that scenario, IMO, is that it diminishes the respect
that half-staff implies. And with >50 Gov's et al. getting to call
the shots, there is no single place that tells you where US flags are
flying at half-staff.
Jim
-snip-
The US changed their code during the last administration to allow
Governors to order flags in their state to half-staff for whatever
reason they choose.
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/4/7(m).html
"In the event of the death of a present or former official . . . or
the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory,
or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of
that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National
flag shall be flown at half-staff"
NY was lowering theirs for every NY soldier killed. I see MT does
something similar. I'll bet most states do.
The problem with that scenario, IMO, is that it diminishes the respect
that half-staff implies. And with >50 Gov's et al. getting to call
the shots, there is no single place that tells you where US flags are
flying at half-staff.
Jim
MomtoConner
New member
Dave Smith wrote in news:qT7np.291686
[email protected]:
I'm not debating protocol, just pointing out the obvious. However,
the flag CAN be lowered to half-mast for any reason the government
decides, and on Parliament Hill, that includes MPs, Senators,
former Governors-General and former Prime Ministers.
I could see the flag atop the Peace Tower from my desk and would
always check, when it was "en berne", the Parliamentary web site
home page as it would explain the reason why in the left-hand
panel. It happens more often than you think.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
[email protected]:
I'm not debating protocol, just pointing out the obvious. However,
the flag CAN be lowered to half-mast for any reason the government
decides, and on Parliament Hill, that includes MPs, Senators,
former Governors-General and former Prime Ministers.
I could see the flag atop the Peace Tower from my desk and would
always check, when it was "en berne", the Parliamentary web site
home page as it would explain the reason why in the left-hand
panel. It happens more often than you think.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
Meme Niehe
New member
On 07/04/2011 8:09 AM, Jim Elbrecht wrote:
Exactly. The flag represents the nation, not the individual.Reserving
the lowering of the flag for the head of state makes it something
special. The thing that irks me most is that people push(ed) for
lowering the flags as if it is the proper thing to do. It isn't. If we
are going to start lowering the flag for individual soldiers and for
people in other public positions and school teachers and students, then
we should lower it for everyone.
In some places flag etiquette is enforced. On one of our trips to
Denmark a friend was anxious about getting home because he had left his
flag up and wanted to get home before dark and he did not want to get
into trouble. When we finally got back he was relieved to find that a
neighbour had taken it down for him.
Exactly. The flag represents the nation, not the individual.Reserving
the lowering of the flag for the head of state makes it something
special. The thing that irks me most is that people push(ed) for
lowering the flags as if it is the proper thing to do. It isn't. If we
are going to start lowering the flag for individual soldiers and for
people in other public positions and school teachers and students, then
we should lower it for everyone.
In some places flag etiquette is enforced. On one of our trips to
Denmark a friend was anxious about getting home because he had left his
flag up and wanted to get home before dark and he did not want to get
into trouble. When we finally got back he was relieved to find that a
neighbour had taken it down for him.
In article ,
[email protected] says...
Maybe they should just decree that it flies at half-staff unless the
President orders otherwise and be done with it.
[email protected] says...
Maybe they should just decree that it flies at half-staff unless the
President orders otherwise and be done with it.
Jim Elbrecht wrote in
news:[email protected]:
"Presidential proclamation"... "flaf(sic) ettiquette"..... what a crock of
shit.
It's a sign of *respect* for what has been done, and what has been given.
You pedants with your precious little ettiquette/rule books...... go shove
'em up your arse.
*Every* time an Aussie soldier is KIA, I lower the flag to half mast at
work.
And it has caught on..... now, right thru' our suburb, whenever an Aussie
is KIA *every* place that flies a flag, lowers it.
It is now done twice for the one soldier. When he is KIA, and when he
finally comes home and makes the last journey to his resting place.
It's all about *respect*.
Phuk the President and his "proclamations".
--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania
Nothing ever truely dies
the Universe wastes nothing
everything is simply... transformed
news:[email protected]:
"Presidential proclamation"... "flaf(sic) ettiquette"..... what a crock of
shit.
It's a sign of *respect* for what has been done, and what has been given.
You pedants with your precious little ettiquette/rule books...... go shove
'em up your arse.
*Every* time an Aussie soldier is KIA, I lower the flag to half mast at
work.
And it has caught on..... now, right thru' our suburb, whenever an Aussie
is KIA *every* place that flies a flag, lowers it.
It is now done twice for the one soldier. When he is KIA, and when he
finally comes home and makes the last journey to his resting place.
It's all about *respect*.
Phuk the President and his "proclamations".
--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania
Nothing ever truely dies
the Universe wastes nothing
everything is simply... transformed
"gloria.p" wrote in
news:[email protected]:
Cute, but lowering the flag to half-mast achieves the same result.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
news:[email protected]:
Cute, but lowering the flag to half-mast achieves the same result.
--
The Bible! Because all the works of science cannot equal the
wisdom of cattle-sacrificing primitives who thought every
animal species in the world lived within walking distance of
Noah's house.
Colmes Warrior
New member
Dave Smith wrote:
In my geography a lot of municipalities have a national flag and a
circle of service flags. When a Marine from the area is killed, the day
it is reported the USMC flag in that town, and so on for any other armed
service.
It's a good compromise. When the governor orders flags at half staff
it's something that spans more than one town. When it's something local
it's a service flag that's lowered. Respect at the local loss without
the loss of national respect.
In my geography a lot of municipalities have a national flag and a
circle of service flags. When a Marine from the area is killed, the day
it is reported the USMC flag in that town, and so on for any other armed
service.
It's a good compromise. When the governor orders flags at half staff
it's something that spans more than one town. When it's something local
it's a service flag that's lowered. Respect at the local loss without
the loss of national respect.
Ms. Frankie
New member
On Apr 7, 6:28?am, Dave Smith wrote:
Someone gave his life for his country -- that's not worthy of respect
where you live?
In few countries do residents fly their flags. Customarily only
government outposts do.
Someone gave his life for his country -- that's not worthy of respect
where you live?
In few countries do residents fly their flags. Customarily only
government outposts do.
On 08/04/2011 1:02 AM, spamtrap1888 wrote:
If people are going to fly flags they should observe the rules. There
are a lot of Americans who own property around here, and people who have
moved here. Some of them fly American flags in their yards. That is
inappropriate to the point of offensiveness. It is acceptable to fly an
American flag if there is a more prominently flown Canadian flag, not
not an American flag on its own.
If people are going to fly flags they should observe the rules. There
are a lot of Americans who own property around here, and people who have
moved here. Some of them fly American flags in their yards. That is
inappropriate to the point of offensiveness. It is acceptable to fly an
American flag if there is a more prominently flown Canadian flag, not
not an American flag on its own.
sixteenfire
New member
In article ,
[email protected] says...
! nonsense
Oh dear. I fly a variety of flags depending on mood and guests,
including Norwegian and Scottish national flags, Buddhist prayer flags and
a love flag I made for my husband's birthday. American and Ethiopian
neighbours and friends neighbour fly Scottish saltires. There's a house
near here which has dozens of national flags from all over the world and
flies a different one each week.
Janet (Scotland)
[email protected] says...
! nonsense
Oh dear. I fly a variety of flags depending on mood and guests,
including Norwegian and Scottish national flags, Buddhist prayer flags and
a love flag I made for my husband's birthday. American and Ethiopian
neighbours and friends neighbour fly Scottish saltires. There's a house
near here which has dozens of national flags from all over the world and
flies a different one each week.
Janet (Scotland)