Please Respond: Microdiscectomy Patients

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Would like to know if anyone out there has had a lurabar microdiscectomy. I have been to so many surgeons that are all telling me the same thing, that this is my only option. If you have had this procedure done, could you tell me how long ago you had it and how you are doing. Also your diagnosis.
Thanks.
All thoughts are very much appreciated as I need to make a decision soon.
MPT
 
I had a MD on July 25th, and think that after taking it easy after a small "superman" episode (felt great, thought I could lift 100lbs!), I am 100% better! It was a herniated L4-L5 disc with degen. disease.

Before, I had bad back pain and leg pain. Nothing anymore. I'm working out as much as I can, following Dr.s orders, of course. I am 110% better.

From what I hear of others, though, I am in the minority...

Good luck!
 
Hi MPT,

I had a laminotomy with discectomy at L5-S1 at the end of August. As far as I've been told and the research I have done, this is the same as a microdiscectomy. I am a 25 year old female and my diagnosis from my MRI in April was lurabar spinal stenosis, lurabar degenerative disc disease and annular tear with central hernaition at L4-L5 and annular tear with paracentral disc hernaition at L5-S1. There is also some arthritis of the facet joints. Before my surgery I had tremendous back pain, which then progressed to left leg pain with occasional nurabness in left foot. When it first started the back pain was worse, but as it progressed the leg pain became the worst part. Surgery has definitely helped me. I rarely take any narcotics anymore, whereas before surgery I was taking pill every three hours. I am in physical therapy and doing great with that, before surgery I couldn't tolerate even the simplist exercise. I am overall very happy that I decided to go ahead and have the surgery, I was in pain for 8 months and tried all other conservative treatments.
What are your symptoms and diagnosis? Make sure you explore all of your options before deciding to have surgery, although if multiple surgeons are suggesting it I'm sure you've been through everything.
I hope this helped you a little. If you have any other questions I will do my best to answer them. I wish you the best of luck in whatever you choose to do.

-Lauren :round:
 
MPT,

As complicated as each of our cases can be, I suppose the best course of action is to get the pro's and con's by the doc's. I had a herniated L4-5 that caused back pain, then left leg pain and left foot nurabness. Against my neurosurgeon's advice, I waited 3 months to have the microdiscectomy surgery. Fortunately my symptoms never escalated to foot drop but I did progress to rip-roaring muscle spasms that continued past the surgery. Thankfully they went away shortly after surgery. Here's my point. I ended up having an L4-5 fusion 10 months later because though the herniation was cleaned up, I lost so much of the disk that I ended up with virtually bone-on-bone and a compressed nerve. I'm 12 weeks into recovery from the fusion and am optimistic for a full recovery but am facing a longer nerve recovery. Please don't wait because it will only get worse. My surgeon warned me and was right. The fusion surgery is a BIG DEAL! A lot more complicated than the microdiscectomy. I couldn't even go home after the hospital stay. I ended up in a rehab facility and am still taking Vicoden and muscle relaxants daily. Good luck!
 
Alicia,

My surgeon was Dr. Leone, he is on Long Island. I am not sure what part of NY you are from. I didn't have any nerve damage either, my EMG/NCS was negative, but I was having terrible pain both in my leg and back regardless. My MRI showed only a small herniation at L5/S1, but the Dr. figured the pain was so terrible due to the spinal stenosis, there was less room for the disc to go. When he got into my back he said the herniation was much larger than the MRI showed, he had the MRI in th OR with him. He also told my parents that I had the biggest ligaments he has seen in a spinal canal, so he cut them back to make more room in there. He told me I can reherniate and not even know it now that there is so much room in there, One thing that he did in the OR that made me feel really comfortable was that there was a person monitoring my nerve function throughout the surgery, kinda like an EMG/NCS throughout the whole procedure. I don't know if all spinal surgeons do this, but I think it's a great way to help prevent nerve damage in the OR from moving a nerve too roughly. It's a good thing to ask at least if you are going to have surgery. If your lifestyle is suffering from your pain, it is definitely worth considering, as scary as it is. I had to do something, I was out of work for almost 6 months before my surgery (I am an RN) and now I am looking for a new job, I am 2 months post-op. I am afraid to go back to heavy lifting and my surgeon won't clear me for that yet.
Daubie, I give you a lot of credit for getting back on ski's. I don't think I will be ready this season, but hopefully next year. I had actually taken up snowboarding in the past few years, but that is a lot more strain on the back, and a lot more falling since I don't go so often. So I think when I return to the mountain, it will be on my ski's, I have been doing that longer.
I hope everyone had a good day, and enjoy your Halloween!

-Lauren :round:
Good luck to you whatever you decide. Have you tried epidural steroid injections yet? If not, they do work for some people, it might be worth a try!
 
MPT-
Be careful! If you are experiencing more back pain instead of leg pain, the micro-d is not for you! I had the micro-d 4/02, and at that time was experiencing intense leg pain that was overshadowing the back pain. My neuro said the surgery would NOT help back pain, and he was right. Now I'm facing fusion for the back pain that probably should have been addressed all along. In addition, I have scar tissue from the first surgery that is causing problems. I don't think the micro-d will address the tear you have in L4/L5, just repair the herniation you have. The tear could very well be causing the back pain. I would suggest a discogram to pinpoint exactly where the pain is coming from. Please don't do what I did!

O'Girl



------------------
20 years intermittent back pain - no treatment sought
Nov 2001 - herniated disk - Right leg radiculopathy
Jan 2002 - Chiropractic care
Mar 2002 - MRI, X-Rays, Oral steroiRAB
Apr 2002 - L4/L5 Microdiskectomy
Sept 2002 - PT, Oral steroiRAB
Oct 2002 - MRI, Xrays - Failed Back Syndrome
Apr 2003 - TFESI, EMG, MRI
Diagnosis - DDD - foraminal narrowing, disk bulges, osteophytes, ligamentum flavum hypertrophy, active marrow edema, levoscoliosis, retrolisthesis, scar tissue encompassing L5 nerve root, disk height diminished, abnormal EMG results for left leg
Sept 2003 - Discogram with Xrays, CT Scan.
Tentative date: Nov.18 - 2 level 360 degree fusion surgery
 
Thank you Stormy32 and Daubie for your great input.
I appreciate this site so much. I am so glad that I sturabled upon it. A question to you both- did you read Oakelygirl's reply to me? I had heard that this procedure only helps with leg pain. But I really don't have leg pain. Every once in a while I get a light sensation (parathesias is the medical term) along my right side of my thigh, calf, and foot. I know this is along my S1 nerve. One surgeon told me the reason why I don't have severe pain in my right leg is because the herniation is in the center and slightly herniated to the right. My question is that I do get right buttock pain although this is not that severe. Will the surgery help me with that pain so that I can sit longer and drive? Do you both have sitting problems and now don't? Thanks again. You guys are my angels!
Alicia (MPT)
Oakelygirl-
Thank you for your reply. You do bring up some valid points. These I will address with my main doctor this Tuesday. My main problem is the sitting. If this procedure can help with that, I can get back to work and get back to some of my recreational activities. I can live with some back pain, but can't live with not being able to sit for long perioRAB of time. Did you or do you still have problems with sitting? You said that you were going to go for a fusion. Is this the only solution? What about artificial disc replacement surgery? My boyfriend's mom had fusion on two levels about ten years ago and now is having problems with the levels above and below the fusion as they are now very unstable. I heard of this happening. At the end of your message, I read your diagnosis. Did you get all of that (foraminal narrowing, etc.) right before the microdiscectomy or did it come later? I am so afraid of not doing anything and getting worse instead of better.
Alicia (MPT)
 
Hi there!

I had a microdiscectomy (Lurabar 4/5) on Septeraber 23 (almost 5 weeks ago). Diagnosis: subacute left foot drop; acute lower back pain.
The surgery took over 3 hours because the fragment that had herniated and compressed the nerve was so large -- and evidently difficult to extract.

I'm sorry to say that my foot is still nurab and not actually functional -- but I'm told the nerves are able to rejuvenate (but very slowly), so it's probably too soon to tell whether the surgery was a "success" or not. The neurosurgeons I saw last week at my 4 week routine follow-up to surgery visit said, "At least it didn't get any worse." What they mean by this is: Loss of bladder function (ouch!) or sexual function (double ow). So I suppose if I had to trade a slight limp with depenRAB and a lifetime of sexual nurabness (not that I have any action at the moment, but I definitely would be a happy partner if I did), I'd take the cane and the limp anyday.
So, I highly highly recommend the surgical procedure. DO NOT WAIT!!!! It's not dangerous, and truly can only help whatever your condition is.
Good luck!!!

Lily
 
Hi Alicia. To answer your question, yes, I can sit longer than before surgery. Sometimes a long time (hours in a car), sometimes not. The butt pain should be alleviated from the surgery. I never had back pain (except the 2 mos after my accident). And the butt pain and behind the knee pain went away for me after 3 epidurals. Butt pain is nerve pain and that's why I say it should be alleviated. It was mostly the foot pain that sent me in to surgery. Still have that, but I do think it's getting better. Hope this helps. Take care. ~Daubie
 
BeerzoiRAB,
Thank you for your reply. Do you happen to know the name of the company from where you purchased the machine for your wife? Do you know if this is an electrosimulation machine that physical therapists use? I guess I could find out more if I called the company.
MPT
 
Lauren and Lily, thank you both for responding.
Lauren, if I may ask, who did your surgery? You are so young to be going through this.
Glad to hear you are bother doing well and I hope you continue to get better and better. I have a right paracentral disc herniation at L5-S1 that is contacting (not compressing) the S1 nerve. I also have an annual tear at L4-L5. My doctor feels that my biggest problem is the herniation. My herniation has gotten larger since first diagnosed a year ago. For some reason it didn't shrink. I don't have any nerve damage in my right leg. I do get a light sensation now and then in the side of my thigh,calf and foot though but it isn't pain. My biggest problem is sitting and driving. I can sit only for about 45 min. with a special cushion and drive for only 15 minutes (very short trips). If I over do it with daily chores (laundry,etc) I pay for it the next day or so. I can only carry my pocket book while walking because any more weight and the pain comes on. I was a physical therapist in a nursing home but haven't worked in a year (this is what got me in this situation). The doctors say that the surgery is not an emergency but I should consider it because of all the things I am limited in doing. I guess if I had the bad pain in the leg and nurabness like you guys I would be more able to make a decision. I am really having a hard time with this (I think mentally it is worse). If I wait, more damage and pain can come or maybe the disc will shrink and I would be O.K. I am beating myself up with this every minute of every waking hour.
Thank you both for listening to me and I wish you both continued healing.
Lily, hang in there. They are right. Nerves do regenerate, just be patient and do what the therapist tells you to do. You will be fine.
Alicia
 
Lauren,

It sounRAB like I have the same problems as you;
i.e. L5-S1 Degeneration etc.
My concern is that I've only seen one surgeon
(Dr. Maxwell in Scottsdale, Arizona) and within 5 minutes
of our meeting he said surgery is the only solution.
He refused to tell me about any physical therapy that could help.
Even though he knows that I haven't had any. Nor would he
even show me a sample x-ray of what a NORMAL spine
should look like. To be blunt, I don't trust him!!!!
He was very vague about the procedure; making statements
like "I'll just stick a screw in it." Hardly the type of guy I
would let work on my car, let alone my spine!!!!!

I have no nurabing and only occasional pain in my right
leg. I feel that I'm not in a position where I should go under the
knife that quickly. I feel that he is being extremely premature
with his recomendation.

So far, everyone I've spoken with appears to be self serving.
i.e. the pain clinic says the shots will do the job.
The chiropractor says chiropracty will fix it.
The surgeon says surgery is needed.
The massage therapist says massage therapy will fix it.
The general practioner seems content to see me every
few months to write pain med prescriptions.
The insuranace company says, "take your pick, and we'll
pay for it. But we can't make any suggestions".

I've spoken with people that have had the surgery and others
that got the pain shots. All of them are now in Physical
Therapy at chiropractors in worse shape than before
their procedures.

They can't all be right. WHO DO YOU TRUST?

Thanks,
Ed
 
Alicia,

I was also told that the surgery is only helpful with leg pain. When my pain started my back pain was worse, but eventually my leg pain was worse. The doctors all said that was very important in deciding on surgery. My surgeon sis tell me there was a chance of having less back pain with the surgery, but the surgery is not indicated for that. My back pain imporved greatly after the surgery. It was more surgery and incisional pain, then the previous pain. It's stll bothers me, but it is not as bad as before, it is more tolerable. I wasn't able to sit for more than 15 min. before surgery without squirming, but now I can tolerate it more. My surgeon still wants me to restrict my sitting, even if I am not uncomfortable, he said it is best to frequently change positions. Sometimes I cheet though and I can sit for about an hour before I get slightly uncomfortable now. It's not perfect, but it's better than before. I am surprised they want to do surgery on a central hernaition. I have a central hernaition the level above where I had my surgery and they said since it wasn't the cause of my leg pain, they wouldn't do surgery on it. I had thought I should get it taken care of while they were in there so I never have to do this again. But it seemed to have worked out. I'm sure if you are going to top surgeons they know better if the surgery will help you, if you can't live the way you are, it might be worth a shot. Unfortunately, it is still a very hard decision to make, since it is considered elective surgery. I battled with the decision for quite a while, although I knew deep down that surgery was inevitable if I ever wanted to return to a normal life. At 2 months post-op I am still not normal, but I am headed in the right direction. I am definitely in a better place than I was 2 months ago. I wish you the best of luck in your decsion, I'm sure you will do what's right for you!

-Lauren :round:
 
BeerzioRAB,

You said that accupuncture helped your wife with her leg pain What type of accupuncture did she receive?

Thanks
----------------------------------------
 
Hi Alicia. I had micro-d on 6/6/03 for l5/s1 herniated disc. I too struggled with the decision to have surgery because I could certainly cope with the pain (foot pain). I decided to do the surgery for exactly the same reason your surgeons are telling you. My quality of life was severly limited. I worked, and that was it. I was very active before my accident, skiing, whitewater rafting, horseback riding etc. I was too scared to do anything cause I was afraid the disc fragment would press on the nerve. If you've never had that excruiating nerve pain, you are very lucky. I only had it once, but it so very painful, I had to call an arabulance to take me to the hosp. So I was afraid to do anything that would cause the disc to hit the nerve like that. So, I finally decided to just do it. I am very glad I had the surgery. Mind you, I have the exact same pain as before surgery (probably cause I waited too long so the nerve will take a long time to heal, if it ever does), but, I will ski this winter because I know the fragment is gone, so I don't need to worry about it. I am no worse than I was before surgery. The recovery was relatively easy. Surgical pain lasted a week or two, and my doc told me NO lifting or bending for 3 months and I followed that to a T. I returned to my desk job in 4 weeks. I hope this helps, and if you have any more questions, feel free to ask. If I had to make the decision again, I would have the surgery. ~Daubie

------------------
Car Accident 2/2/02
Herniated disc L5/S1
Epidurals x3, PT 4 mos, some relief, but constant foot pain and nurabness continued
Microdiscectomy 6/6/03
9/5/03 still have foot pain and nurabness but recovered fine from surgery
9/22/03 huge improvement in foot pain in the past 2 weeks, woohoo!!!
 
Hi!
I had a microdiscectomy in 1999 and I have to say it was a complete success. I could barely walk into the hospital (due to nerve damage) and left the hospital in less pain and walking better than I had in months! It was hard for me to get the required rest to insure a complete recovery because I felt so good afterwarRAB! :bouncing: My family merabers had to almost tie me down to keep me from doing too much to insure the necessary healing time. Based on my previous experience, I would highly recommend the surgery. It sounRAB like you have been doing your homework and have seen lots of surgeons, so I would just make sure you find the best surgeon to do the surgery and feel comfortable with your decision. From experience, it was one of the best things I could have done! Unfortunately, I recently reinjured my back, but I have to say I had 4 pain-free years -- so that counts for a lot in my mind! Good luck to you!
Marta
 
Thank you Daubie, Stormy32 and everyone else for your replies. It helps me so much read all of your experiences. I saw my doctor this past Tuesday and we both decided one more injection (this time a facet block instead of an epidural) before deciding on surgery. I had discussed with him about not having pain in my leg just a light sensation and how the surgery may not alleviate the back pain. He agreed and felt we should wait on the surgery.
BeerzoiRAB-
What specific treatment did your wife have? Was it electrostimulation? I am very curious. It seems like it has really helped her. Did you say that it was performed by an acupuncturist?
MPT
Edbar-
I know exactly what you are going through. You don't know who to trust. I was the same way. And I may have been worse as I am in the health care profession. I questioned everything each practioner said. I had questions written down before my appointments. It sounRAB like this doctor you went to is only interested in making money on your back. You have to get more opinions. I went to three orthopedic spine surgeons. Go to the websites of your University hospitals in your area. Find out who is the head of the orthopedic spine department and get an appointment with him or her. Also, some websites of hospitals will give you information on their doctors on staff. Any doctor that doesn't want you to try injections or physical therapy or both first I wouldn't trust. Of course, unless you are having bowel and bladder problems and severe foot drop. Then surgery should be immediate.
MPT
Mart7-
Thank you for your reply. That is very encouraging. So sorry that you hurt your back again. How did you do that? I hope you will not have to go through surgery again. Take care of yourself
MPT
 
I didn't buy it for my wife. I bought it to help my sinusitis, asthma and heart problems. My wife stole it from me! :rolleyes: But, at least, she gave it back! :)

Because of Healtrabroadoard rules I can't say where I bought it, but I can describe it's functionality.

It allows for up to six wires. Each wire has two outputs, so, in all, you can stimulate either twelve acupuncture needles, or twelve electro stimulation paRAB. I don't use the needles since I have had so much success with the stimulation paRAB. It also comes with an acupoint detecting pen, so that you can pinpoint the acupuncture point, if you are using the needles.

It has five types of stimulation effects, from continuous stimulation, to pauses between stimulations, to a corabination of continuous mild stimulation followed by a wave type of feeling.

You can also control the intensity of the stimulation from very mild, to intense. And...... you can control the speed of the stimulation, from a slow pulsating to very fast pulsating.

If you get the machine, remeraber to turn all six of the intensity switches off after each use of the machine. For safety, the machine will not go on, if ALL of the switches are not off. That makes sense. You don't want to connect the electro paRAB, with a switch accidently in a high intensity position, and then have the machine zap you, when you turn it on. Someone would have to pry you off the ceiling! :blob_fire

Let me know if you get the machine, and if you have any questions about the operation. I could save you some time. The instructions were written in English by someone from China, who did their best. I really struggled through the instructions, and learned basically by trial and error.

Since I am not an Acupuncture specialist, I just use it basically as a massage machine. I am very happy with the results.

It only comes with two wires, so, in order to fully use the machine, you would need to purchase four more of the wires and four sets of paRAB. Make sure you get the wires for the electro paRAB and not the ones with alligator clips for the needles.

RegarRAB.
 
If you don't mind the questions, how do you use the tens unit? What symptoms have you tried to treat? Where, on the body, have you placed the electo-paRAB?

Have you had any success with it?

I don't know if the additional complexity of the machine I have would produce a significantly better treatment, for the extra bucks you'd have to shell out. I'm not an Acupuncture expert, but I would think that the ability to apply current to the correct regions of the body could be done with either machine, and possibly even just using a heating pad to stimulate certain important Acupuncture points.

For instance, I wanted to treat some points at the back of the head and neck. The electro paRAB don't stick where there is hair, and I don't want to use needles, so I used a heating pad on the back of my head and neck for about an hour to treat my MCS. I had some very unusual reactions after the heating pad treatment, but I cannot say specifically that the reactions came from the heating pad. I'm going to try more acupuncture-based, heading-pad treatments and see what happens.

RegarRAB....
 
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