Miss Manners on dining out: "Who should get the check?"

Kunmui

New member
Found this.

Lenona.

http://lifestyle.msn.com/relationships/article.aspx?cp-documentid=27656377

Dear Miss Manners,
Who should get the check? My question is in regards to the etiquette
of getting the check at the end of the meal. I was raised that if it
was not made very clear at the beginning (such as "don't worry we are
taking you out"), to always make an effort to pay. My parents taught
me it is polite to put up a little "argument over it," and I have
always tried to do this when I have the opportunity; whether it is
simply paying for myself or picking up the entire check.

My husband believes if you are out with someone a little more well off
you should simply take their offer, no argument.

I feel like this is rude, but my problem is that I am just out of
college and recently married. I can't necessarily follow through with
the "argument" if I win. We see our parents on a pretty regular basis,
and so tend to eat out with them frequently. The informality of these
dinners means that no one specifies who pays for whom. Should dinners
like these be understood as just dutch, or is it okay to simply accept
as soon as they reach for the bill?

Gentle Reader,
Your husband's theory that those with more money should subsidize the
entertaining of those with less is doomed. Miss Manners promises you
that eventually, the perpetual hosts will feel that they are valued
only for their ability to pick up the bill.

Yes, sometimes even parents. The long habit of paying for their
children often remains; many parents prefer to continue to do so and
will make sure they win any such polite arguments as you mention. But
even they will be flattered if you occasionally make a point of
issuing a clear invitation at which you are the hosts -- at a place
that you can afford.
 
Miss Manners on dining out: "Who should get the check?"

On Feb 13, 3:22?pm, Lenona wrote:

*Sigh* Do you have the hots for Miss Manners???
 
On Sun, 13 Feb 2011 13:22:19 -0800 (PST), Lenona
wrote:


How true! It's especially nice when parents are retired and their
children have eclipsed their pre-retirement salaries. I'll let my
kids can pay for me any time. They can afford it. :)

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
 
In article , [email protected]
says...

:-) It gives them so much pleasure to arrange outings and surprises,
for us, give us their professional advice etc.

Ours regarded it as a kind of right of passage into equal-adulthood; the
first time each one reached for the bill and said "This is on me".


Janet.
 
"itsjoannotjoann" wrote in message
news:[email protected]...
(How would you know if you're out with someone a little more well off?)

I agree with Ed. If I invite you, it's my treat. If you invite me, I
expect you to pay. But the ground rules really should be set down in
advance. For example, I took care of my neighbor's cats when she was gone
for two weeks. When she got back she said, "Let me take you to lunch."
That's clear-cut, well defined. She paid for lunch. When she drove me and
my cat to Charleston so my cat could undergo a medical procedure I made it
clear I was paying for the gas AND taking her to lunch. Again, clear-cut.

As for parents paying for adult children's meals or vice versa, we weren't
really a go out to dinner family. But I don't recall my parents ever
turning down one of us offering to pay the check.

Jill
 
Miss Manners on dining out: "Who should get the check?"

On Feb 14, 10:29?am, "jmcquown" wrote:


If only everyone would do that..........

From a hotheaded male at Glennsacks.com (the site, which is mainly
about the rights of divorced fathers, has changed drastically and you
can't find comments there anymore, so I'm guessing the audience has
shifted to www.fathersandfamilies.org )

"This all has very little to do with money. Neither does it have
anything to do with fancy-shmancy arguments. It's really quite simple.
If I'm sitting across the table from a woman who touts her grrrlll
power during a date, and then when the check comes, she runs for the
women's room or hides her head in the sand, I know she's full of
S__t.

"She's a con artist and a liar. Why? Because she claims to be one
thing, then acts like another thing.

"THE MONEY IS NOT THE ISSUE.
"I'll say it again:
"THE MONEY IS NOT THE ISSUE.

"The issue, for me at least, is CHARACTER AND INTEGRITY. It's about
someone saying 'This is what I am,' and then acting that way."

(end)

He may have a point, assuming he didn't formally ask her out, but he's
clearly missing the obvious - that it only makes sense to determine in
ADVANCE who's going to be paying for what, to avoid AWKWARDNESS. Seems
to me, when you're a man "invited" by a woman, it's as easy as saying:
"Sounds nice. Are we going Dutch?" (Few women, I hope, would splutter
and say: "I thought YOU would pay for ME.") If you don't want to go
Dutch, you can say: "Sounds nice, but I'm afraid we'll have to go out
some other time - I'm saving money for X." Then, at least, the woman
is free to say "no, I mean I want to treat you to lunch." IF she means
that.

MM once said in a 1980s book(?) that when a woman who is not a hooker
goes around trying to get men to buy drinks for her, one repsonse from
the men could be: "And here I was hoping you'd buy me
one."

Lenona.
 
Lenona wrote:


Boy, women must be lining up to date a charmer like him. If you are
going to begrudge taking me out for dinner, don't ask me. It's that
simple. I am not someone who feels comfortable not paying my
way, and I have insulted guys by offering to chip in for the check,
but if we're on our first date and you're looking hard at me to see
how I act when the bill comes, I'd rather stay home. We have no
long term prospects anyway, because that kind of attitude isn't
for me.

nancy
 
Miss Manners on dining out: "Who should get the check?"

On Feb 14, 12:19?pm, "Nancy Young"
wrote:



Yes, well, as I implied, chances are he's under the impression that,
even if you do the (vague) inviting, it's ALWAYS supposed to be a
Dutch date unless you say, early on, that it isn't. A lot of "hosts,"
both male and female, mistakenly make that assumption.

Of course, if she's the one who made the suggestion that they go out
to eat but now is acting as though he should pay for ALL of it, that's
clearly a lot worse.

Another thing to wonder about is: If she's such a take-charge,
braggart type as he describes, how hard would it have been for her to
ask, early on, whether he was treating her or not?

Lenona.
 
On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 10:07:01 -0800 (PST), Lenona
wrote:


It's pretty simple. Pay for dinner and don't go out with her again.

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
 
Lenona wrote:

I'm with Nancy all the way on this one. If I were on a first date and
was invited to dinner, I would expect him to pay. If I knew the
person well strictly as a friend, I'd have no hesitation in saying,
"Fine but let's go Dutch". If he'd taken me out quite a few times,
I'd say (and have said), "This is my treat".
That way, I can keep my independence and live with myself.

Dora
 
Miss Manners on dining out: "Who should get the check?"

On 2/13/2011 4:22 PM, Lenona wrote:

It seems to me that is the dinner/lunch is suggested in the following
manner it is dutch - "How about getting together for lunch on Tuesday?"
or "Would you like to go out for dinner next Saturday?" or something
like that.

But if you say "I'd like to take you out to dinner on Friday." or if
someone sayst that to you, that means the person doing the inviting is
paying.

If you do go on a supposed "dutch" either party may decide that they
want to pay for the other and say, "That's okay, I'll get the check."
or something to that effect.

I think that's very straight forward. Just because one person
"suggests" the meal doesn't mean they are offering to pay. It's when
they say "Let me take you to dinner." that they are offering to pay.

Kate

--
Kate Connally
?If I were as old as I feel, I?d be dead already.?
Goldfish: ?The wholesome snack that smiles back,
Until you bite their heads off.?
What if the hokey pokey really *is* what it's all about?
mailto:[email protected]
 
On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 14:15:15 -0500, Kate Connally
wrote:


I think only people who don't get out much are confused by the
language.

--

Today's mighty oak is just yesterday's nut that held its ground.
 
Why are people so afraid to utter the D word PRIOR to entering the
resto? I make no qualms about making it clear that it's a Dutch deal.

Thing that kills ME is acquaintances who enter a resto, spy you,
plunk down at your table, barely cover their meals, then bolt. I've
gotten stuck picking up the tax and tip for these types a few times.
 
Goomba wrote:


If i invite some one to dine or even eat with me in advance, r.s.v.p. or
spur of the moment, i presume it is understood that i am providing or
paying for the food (or at least offering to do so), if i am asked i
assume the same, that the person who asks me is taking responsibility
for any payment. However, due to my experience of life, i never go
into a restaurant with out the means to pay for anything i might consume
or otherwise purchase, i used to wear a belt with a $100 bill in its
inside zippered pocket when i went out for an evenings revelry:)

There are exceptions such as pot lucks, and any other such or type of
gathering where one is invited to eat (if not dine) but requested in the
invitation to bring a suitable dish of ones own choosing to help provide
the meal or food. Or a group meal where it is decided in advance how
payment will be made, either separate checks or a single payer & we all
pay our part + tip of.

This can get complicated in night-clubs, taverns & such where one
person takes it on themselves, with or without consultation to "run a
tab' on their credit card and then expect the people they are with to
reimburse for their own drinks and any snacks ordered.

I have never been in such a situation but i have seen it happen to others.
--
JL
 
"J. Clarke" wrote:



Try taking 200 hungry potential corporate customers out for a free
meal!!!

Take over the "Tavern on the Green" [RIP], Central Park, NYC sometime.
See what happens!!!

Been there! Done that!

There's no destiny in debating who pays and foregone conclusionst!!!
Just scramble to pay the bill first!!!

Andy
 
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